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You forgot ugly, lazy and disrespectful.

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by E. Tuffmen, Feb 16, 2011.

  1. E. Tuffmen

    E. Tuffmen
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    So, this morning I read this article about a teacher who thinks kids are getting a pass in life from parents and teachers and said as much in her blog. It certainly seems as if she is correct, and I find it typical that she was immediately suspended by the school board even though that was not the main focus of the blog.

    FOCUS: Discuss how awesome this teacher is for caring enough to be annoyed by her students lack of ambition and apparent apathy by parents everywhere. Or discuss what a bitch she is for betraying the students trust.

    Alternate focus: Did you care about high school grades and feel entitled to sail through your schooling?
     
  2. DrFrylock

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    Be careful what you blog, and if you're going to blog shit about people make sure to anonymize it and yourself, and never, ever connect those things to you. They can't Wahoo you if they don't know who you are, eh?
     
  3. Rush-O-Matic

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    Frylock - What kind of mod are you? I thought you were like, Mr Computer. If you bump the thread and if it's easily found online, why didn't you include links to her blog contents?
     
  4. example

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    FOCUS: She can point it out, but who wants to hear that? Definitely not the parents or the school board. The concept of making the students want to learn is all I seem to hear about at my college. They keep giving us these surveys in my gen-eds asking how to better suit my educational preferences. The way I see it is, at this level, if you want to learn you'll learn. Now of course little kids don't want to learn, and fucking right most high school students don't want to learn, but how much of this is because we live in America where J-bieber and Payton Manning are some of the richest people in the country? Or what about Lil Wayne? Why the fak should any kid want to do good in school when they could be living this fantasy life full of fancy cars and flashy clothes by rapping?

    Alternate focus: I didn't care about my high school grades because I was too busy with trying to form a social life. It's in our nature to be more intrigued by social contact than words on a page. I mean, who would give up sex for reading a book? Probably very few. If you don't put a massive amount of pressure on the importance of schooling, nobody is going to really try.
     
  5. Nom Chompsky

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    I purposefully didn't have sex in high school, and I enjoyed reading plenty of good books. So...me?

    Anyway, I think Petyon Manning and Lil' Wayne are great examples for high schoolers, as long as they're used as examples of the right thing; if you're endowed with massive talents and you work incredibly hard for something, success will probably follow. Lil' Wayne isn't some flash in the pan -- he's been rapping for 17 YEARS now. He's 28 (!).
     
  6. example

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    You're right they could be used as role-models for hard work and dedication to their craft, but that's not what you see on tv or cd. People often forget (especially the younger ones) that there is so much planning and practice involved because the publicized portion is a finished product.

    More power to ya on the sex thing.
     
  7. Guy Fawkes

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    Good for her saying something about the shitty behavior & attitude of kids. But what a turd to write it as part of some self aggrandizing* blog.

    I honestly feel bad for any teacher trying to educate kids that are old enough to use google on their phones. I'm amazed at how smart mouthed but knowledgeable they are about many things.

    For example a week ago I had dinner with my Uncle and 13 year old cousin. He was very very informed about what was going on in Egypt, and correctly corrected his father multiple times on things he and I were discussing. His reason for being so informed. "Facebook is fricken awesome. They totally overthrew that government." Not summarily true, but that idea got him informed about the last 30 years of Egypt's political history.

    So when someone like a 60 year old forever-tenure social sciences teacher tries to talk current events with his class, how quickly does he feel outclassed?

    When curiosity and questions can be answered with a few clicks of a browser what roll will teachers play?


    * I didn't read every page of her blog. But that was my overall sense of it.
     
  8. RCGT

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    Focus: I'm a bit torn as well. I had my share of awesome teachers in high school, and they dealt with some of the same issues as she is... but they were teaching students selected for their motivation and behavior (Honors- and AP- level). My gut feeling is, if they don't want to learn, don't try to make them learn. Let them get stuck in a cycle of minimum wage jobs and slowly realize, "Hey, maybe I shouldn't have called my teacher a rampant whore when she told me to shut up and learn my algebra." Teaches them the lesson right. Call me a humanitarian.

    Alt focus: I never really cared as much as my peers about grades, but considering my peers were a bunch of backstabbing Adderall-popping "AP kids," think that's a healthy thing. I ended up in the top X GPAs in my school anyway, and I never had a nervous breakdown. Point is, I was a goody-two-shoes... never disruptive, a little bit of a class clown but I respected my teachers. And they (generally) respected me in return, if for no other reason than I was intellectually curious.

    (That's another weird thing about honors and AP classes... the kids who are in there are often not intellectually curious, but only care about what's going to be on the test. Not all, of course, but there is a fair share of people who got in there just by grinding away at the textbook until they remember it well enough to regurgitate it.)

    Nowadays in college, I'm a huge fucking slacker... I, in my infinite self-delusion, prefer to think of it as prioritization. Why listen to a history teacher slowly explain the influence of Oriental art on Egypt (something I don't give a shit about) when I could be on Wikipedia, actually reading about Napoleon's invasion of Egypt and its effects?

    I'm taking 18 credits this semester on top of extra-curriculars that basically amount to a job, and I make sacrifices in the diligence of my schoolwork so I can do everything I want and remain sane.
     
  9. Binary

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    Alt Focus: I'm just the opposite of the poster above me.

    I was a huge slacker in high school. I did, quite literally, nothing after I got home from school. I didn't study, I didn't do homework, and long term projects/papers were generally whipped up in one morning before I went to school the day they were due.

    I always did okay because I would ace tests and could write great papers. I wrote an entire 6 page paper explaining the symbolism of Snow Falling on Ceders after only reading the back of the book. I guess I didn't feel entitled to the grades I got, I just knew I could get away with it.

    I didn't go to college after high school. Went into the work force, eventually found my way back to school 6 years later. 6 years in a real job gives you some perspective for how easy college is. I was in a rigorous technology program, working 35 hours/week, and I graduated in 3 years with a 3.9 GPA. It's absolutely amazing how much college students will complain about rolling out of bed before noon or writing a few page paper.
     
  10. KIMaster

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    Focus-

    I would say the teacher is freaking stupid, not awesome. Of course she is right, but everyone who hasn't forgotten their high school days knows this fact as well as the back of their hand. What will crying about it in a blog do?

    Well, get her suspended, apparently.

    Alt Focus-

    In high school, I rarely ever paid attention in class. Most of the time, I would be reading something else, or playing games on a laptop. Reading homework was rarely done until right before the test/essay, homework was done right before I went to sleep the night before, very early in the morning as I was getting ready for school, or recess/lunch.

    I would study either the night before or the morning of, usually trying to learn a months' worth of material in a matter of a few hours. At one point, I asked my AP Chemistry teacher 20 minutes before our biggest exam what a "buffer" was...he laughed, because this was the main subject of our lectures and homework for the last 3-4 weeks, and at least a third of the test. I managed to get a 90% on it...and I was disappointed.

    While my grades weren't perfect for this reason, they were still excellent, and I got into a very prestigious college.

    While I managed to place out of stuff there, I had a very hard time with problem sets my freshman year. There were only a few classes where I could get away with the same bullshit I had pulled in high school, and for a long time, I couldn't adjust.

    I remember when this hit me; the third week's Abstract Algebra set, and I had laid out 5 hours before it was due to complete it. There were 5 problems. As I started reading the text and trying to solve the problems, I grew more and more nervous. I can't fucking do this. Not with so little time to learn and solve the material. I managed to solve 3 of them; I couldn't even come up with anything for the other two.

    It's one thing when you're dealing with an over-hyped but secretly trivial AP class. (That is, all of them)

    It's quite another when you have something ACTUALLY time-consuming, highly theoretic, with legitimate problems in front of you. Guess I'm not so brilliant.

    Obviously, I shaped up big time, and became far more responsible during my next three years there. I still remember investing about 30 hard hours over 3 days into an infinite time limit final.
     
  11. Arctic_Scrap

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    I applaud this woman for at least speaking up about something that is a touchy subject. I don't have any evidence but I'd bet it's fact that every teacher would want to say this. In the politically correct world we live in today it often means losing a job or a public stoning of sorts if you really speak your mind about something, even if it's true. I really can't stand how we have to carefully plan our words or skate around issues because there will be an unnecessary outrage about it by people scared to say the same thing. On the other hand, high school years are your most important years to develop who you are. I know plenty of people that were little shits[myself somewhat included] but are doing just fine today. Every past generation loves to think the future is doomed due to the immaturity or laziness of the current generation. Each generation will have its' people that grow up and achieve greatness.

    Alternate focus:
    I had something like a 2.1 or so GPA throughout high school. I when I think about it, I'm not sure why I even tried that hard. Unless you're going to some prestigious college your grades really don't mean shit, having money to pay is what's important to them. Yes, you might get a scholarship or something with a high GPA, good for you though. While I was a bit of a jackass throughout high school I had enough manners to keep quiet in class. I actually failed some classes but still passed just based on the fact that I wasn't a disruption or annoyance in class. I'm in college now but graduated high school 7 years ago. I am only doing a 2 year program and it's admittedly fairly easy but I do have a ~3.8 GPA.
     
  12. BL1Y

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    It only makes sense to teach them a lesson if there's still a chance to correct their behavior. Ten years down the line, it doesn't matter if they learn the lesson, they can't go back and behave themselves better the rest of the time they're in school.

    As a teacher, your job is to get the children to learn. Doesn't matter if they don't want to, your job is not to give them whatever they ask for.

    Most of the problem is that these teachers don't command any respect. If it's clear you'd rather be somewhere else, don't know the material, and have basically checked out for the last 5 years, of course your students are going to screw around.
     
  13. redbullgreygoose

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    FOCUS: The post above me is spot on. It sucks that she got in trouble for speaking her mind. But she should have been smart enough to know that is the world we live in.

    Alt- Focus: I graduated high school with a 3.3 or something. In Florida there is a scholarship called Florida Brights that will pay either 100% or 75% of your tuition at any Florida college. In my 9th grade year I got almost perfect grades because I wanted the 100% but then slacked off and only ended up with 75%. I wish I had worked harder but I did a lot better than the majority of my class. Most of my friends were just struggling to graduate when the time came and I had all my credits by the beginning of my senior year because the school board kept lowering the standards to make sure everyone graduated. Even though I did well I have to be honest and admit I did slack off. The only reason I did well is because it came easy to me (it's only fucking high school). I beat myself up over not getting 100% of my tuition paid for all the time. I met all the other requirements (SAT/ACT scores, volunteer hours, extracurricular activities). What I really wanted was a football scholarship and the only ones that were given to me were to out of state "colleges" no one had ever heard of. I knew I wasn't good enough for anything besides D3, just better than most in the county. I opted for only 75% and the academic scholarship. Academics really is the way to success. What makes it even worse is that I could have juggled both extracurricular activities along with academics and still gotten a full academic scholarship. On paper it 75% sounds like an accomplishment most people should be proud of but I'm pissed because I know I could have done better and didn't. Luckily for me my parents have quite a bit of enough money to pay for the rest of the tuition. I've been lucky in many areas and I'd hate to see it all be for nothing. But I at least feel like I learned my lesson and work harder today.
     
  14. redbullgreygoose

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    How it a teacher supposed to command respect? They are restricted by the rules of the school board. Some kids want to learn and some do not. What is a teacher supposed to do? You could tie the kid down to a chair and just as many still wouldn't want to learn. There is NOTHING a teacher can do to make a kid learn who doesn't want to. A teacher's job is to teach to the students who care about learning. As for the others, forget about them. Do you know how much time it would eat up if a teacher corrected a student every time they were slacking off? When was the last time you were a student?
     
  15. jordan_paul

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    I did fairly well in highschool, doing the University level and shop classes. (The three difficulty levels were: Workplace, College, University). I would have to say though I was the slacker in highschool. I never did homework, and only half of the major assignments. The only reason I did so well was because I could bullshit my way through tests and got the teachers to like me. Hell, I would drink beers with my Autoshop teacher at his house and I went on a six day boat trip with my Woodshop teacher and the Reserve Unit he commanded because I built the masts, deck and railing for it. When I would get high as shit at lunch time those guys would look at me and say "Jordan_Paul, you're too fucked up for class today, go outback until your next class." After all that I managed to finish highschool with an 85 percent average.
     
  16. BL1Y

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    I was last a student in May 2008.

    If you think tying students down gets respect, you're pretty far off track. I've been a teacher, and I was younger than the majority of my students; the classes would have gotten really out of hand if I had let it.

    One good way to get the students to respect you is to start class exactly on time. Don't wait for people trickling in late, just start teaching. When you wait, you not only hand over control of the class to the students, but you're sending a message that what you're saying isn't really that important. In my class, what I was going to say mattered, and my students made damn certain to be in their seats, notebooks out, ready to learn the moment it was time to start.
     
  17. redbullgreygoose

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    I didn't make that claim, and if your students respected you then that's great. But being respected by the students doesn't meant they'll want to learn. If what you say it true than congratulations but the respect isn't the issue. It's whether your student will want to learn. I agree, you had a much better chance getting students to learn if they're listening to you and paper plane aren't flying around between each bell. However, there is no way you didn't have some students that were just sitting there bored daydreaming all day and not paying attention. Although AP classes attract more motivated kids, it happens there as well. The ones who want to learn will and the ones who don't won't. There is nothing a teacher can do to reach a kid dedicated to not learning.
     
  18. lostalldoubt86

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    I have mixed feelings about this. On the one hand, she did not mention any names, she should be able to anonymously vent her frustrations online. I know it's not the best resource, but it's not something she should be fired over. This is my belief as a writer.

    On the other hand, it's her job as a teacher to find the best way to reach her students. This involves setting rules to fight against grade-grubbing and as a means of earning respect. It also involves changing her lessons if she is unable to reach students. Being a teacher involves figuring out the best way to reach students. The fact that she sees her students the way she does says more about her abilities as a teacher than the state of today's youth. This is my belief as a teacher.

    Bottom line: She doesn't deserve to be fired because of what she said, but she doesn't deserve to be a teacher if she's going to have such a shit attitude about her job.
     
  19. audreymonroe

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    Alt-focus:

    In high school, I cared about my grades but I was never one of those students that tortured myself over getting high marks. I did my work, and I studied but never slaved over a test and didn't give a shit about the SATs. There were some subjects that I wasn't great in, but I didn't beat myself up over it. I took a lot of APs because I enjoyed the challenge, so I didn't mind working harder for them. I could've never been one of those kids who quarantined themselves until they had every line of a textbook memorized though. I graduated with perfectly impressive numbers to show colleges and was able to actually have a life all at the same time.

    In college I barely gave a thought to my grades. I knew that no one was ever going to look at my transcripts in the real world or ask for my GPA, at least not in the industries I'm interested in. It was always more about the actual process of learning, which is such a better approach to education. I was actually interested in the classes I was taking, so I did the work and if I felt that I had a good grasp on the material by the end of the class I was happy. The high grades were nice, but it wasn't what was most important to me. And besides, I didn't really understand the grading at my school and found it kind of frustrating. It was common that I'd get a paper or project back with all positive comments and then it would get a B. Shrug. I got perfectly respectable grades, but I thought I earned higher grades in a lot of my classes. I really didn't let it get to me though.
     
  20. archer

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    I was a fairly indifferent student in high school, with a couple of exceptions, i really loved history and ancient history and i would read through the text books within the first few weeks of term and then ask the teachers for additional reading. This was primarily due to engaging teachers that made those subjects interesting, when i showed interest it got them even keener to teach me and the more they taught me the more interested i became.

    Beyond that i never did any homework and usually did assignments the night before they were due. I was able to right up essays very easily with little to no research into the subject, which is mainly what got me through highschool, most of my final subjects were chosen because the exams were primarily essay based.

    This followed me through to University where i bullshitted my way through 3 years of a shitty degree i really had no interest in (having to plead my case with the Dean every semester on why i should be allowed to sit the exam when i never attended class) before dropping out and going on an extended holiday to Europe. I really should go back and finish the final year part-time or get credits for a course I'm actually interested in but i never seem to get around to it...