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Whatta Girl Wants

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Parker, Jul 29, 2013.

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  1. xrayvision

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    He's probably not having sex at all. Shit like that is a real great way to kill the mood, fast. I feel like if shits getting hot and you stop to ask if its ok to progress things further, you've destroyed the moment.

    One way I gain consent without verbally asking is just have her put it in when the moment arrives. Let your penis fiddle around down there and she will just grab it and finish the job. I figure if she puts it in herself, she must want it to be inside.
     
  2. ghettoastronaut

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    Given the title and author of this thread, this is not what I expected it to be.

    Also, the fact Nom hasn't posted in here makes me concerned. Maybe he's had an aneurysm from reading this thread.
     
  3. FreeCorps

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    I see Miss Pinkcup has logged on and I'll admit I am very excited.
     
  4. Pinkcup

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    I'm definitely having some sort of rage stroke right now. I am going to go to CVS and measure my blood pressure before deciding whether or not I can come back and respond to the horseshit I have read in this thread.
     
  5. ghettoastronaut

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    Oh, does anyone else remember this?

    <a class="postlink-local" href="http://www.theidiotboard.com/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=108719&hilit=serious+discussion+about+feminism" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">viewtopic.php?f=1&t=108719&hilit=serious+discussion+about+feminism</a>
     
  6. Pinkcup

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    You know what? No. One thing needs to be addressed right fucking now: being cisgendered is a goddamned privilege. This isn't a term that had its genesis in some absurd oppression-measuring contest between trans folk and and "normal folk." No, no, no. Ugh. That's the fucking stupidest thing I've ever read, and y'all should feel deeply embarrassed for believing that crap and disseminating that crock of shit elsewhere on the Internet.

    When your gender doesn't match the sexual organs you've been given at birth, that's a motherfucking awful feeling. Awful. You want to talk about struggle? These people have struggled with the very core of their identity for years, sometimes decades, sometimes lifetimes. Imagine for a moment, you unempathetic shitstains, not being able to grasp a sense of self or have a cohesive identity because you feel like you're inhabiting a stranger's body EVERY DAY OF YOUR EXISTENCE. Forget discrimination, forget prejudice, forget bigotry, forget sexism, forget ageism, forget racism...those are all of the oppressions that can exist on top of your utter inability to define yourself as male or female. Seriously. Just fucking think about it. I know it's hard to operate a brain when it's so far inside of your own asshole, but now is the time to clear out some shit and actually examine your privileges.

    It is a goddamned privilege to identify with the sexual organs you were given at birth. Truly. There is a whole universe of pain and struggle and suffering that you will never have to experience. The absence of intense psychic suffering is normal to you. These people don't get to experience that without first going through a metric fuckload of struggle and strife. They go through all of that suffering and discomfort and soul-searching in order to be just like you. That thing you take for granted...being able to say "I'm a man" or "I'm a woman" without a second thought? Others hope and pray and wish and dream every fucking day and night that they can one day be in a position to do such a thing.

    That's why "cisgendered" exists. Because most of us are deeply unaware of the fucking blissful existences we lead and we need helpful terms to open our eyes and kickstart our empathy.

    EDIT: And with all the unnecessary and harmful gender coding and gendered socialization that our culture puts people though, growing up trans would feel awfully fucking oppressive. I'm cisgendered, but it's not hard for me to see how very unwelcome and uncomfortable life would be for me if I were trans. Not being freely and happily permitted to express your identity because it doesn't match your genitals is pretty goddamned oppressive.
     
  7. Nom Chompsky

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    Ok, I am operating on somewhat little sleep, so this might just be semi-coherent:

    I know that a lot of the stuff I post might suggest otherwise, but I often find "male feminist allies" tiresome, and exactly for some of the reasons you do: the obsequiousness, the lack of spine, the intellectual laziness masquerading as open-mindedness. This guy isn't exactly a deep thinker, and he's regurgitating a lot of 101 stuff without adding much insight or cleverness.

    He is what we in the urban communities call a basic bitch.

    All of that being said, there are a lot of "his" ideas being attacked that really shouldn't be.

    *Cisgender is just a way of differentiating from transgender. It's a widely used term, not because people want to feel special, but because it's sometimes applicable; in this case, when he's talking about privilege, gender identity, etc. it makes sense to say. In most conversations, it wouldn't even come up.

    *Consent can be a really tricky thing. A lot of people have ended up in situations where there was a disagreement on whether consent had been given and so it's not unreasonable for somebody to prioritize safety over spontaneity, even though it takes the heat out of some sex. All that being said, (in practice), with two enthusiastic and interested partners, getting consent doesn't have to be so dry as "can I do this? can I touch that?" -- engaged, interested body language and semi-verbal declarations ("mmm" and "yeahhh") can both serve as evidence that both partners are into it. What he's trying to get at, in his own clumsy way, is the idea that consent can and should be an active thing.

    *If you really want verbalized consent, an easy way to do that is to talk about fucking before you do it. Not that consent can't be revoked, but if you send her a text that says, "I'm going to spank your ass red" and she replies with "yes please", it's at the very least a much clearer starting point.

    *As for a guy identifying as a feminist...I personally don't know. Some days I feel like it's an applicable term for my set of views. Other days I feel like it's a baggy and unwieldy term, and is used by not-insignificant number of people who wouldn't even think a man could be a feminist. It's a complicated thing, for me personally.

    *I don't really like the term "rape culture", but I absolutely agree that we (including this very board, including ME on this very board), treat women's bodies as commodities, a lot. And it's fucked up.

    *At the same time, we're human beings, and we're sexual, and people like being objectified (on their terms). It's not a black and white issue of objectification vs. respect. It's possible to do both, and a worthwhile thing to work towards.



    Again, this guy is kind of a tool. But it has nothing to do with the validity of a large percentage of his views, and some of the replies in this thread kind of underscore why he's being so careful.
     
  8. Pinkcup

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    Fuck it.

    Well, you might be a rapist. You also might not be. Now, should I wait until you're unzipping on top of me before I decide? Serious question.

    Because if you end up being a rapist, I will get blamed for not doing everything in my power to avoid the situation that led me to being raped. If I walked along the sidewalk late at night and didn't avoid a strange man who walked towards me, I must've been awfully naive to think that harm wouldn't befall me. I mean, I'm not being blamed for my rape...no, no. That would be cruel. But I didn't take proper precautions, and sometimes rape is the result of that. I have to think about these things, you know? What am I wearing? Am I alone? Am I walking timidly? What about too loudly...definitely don't want to attract attention with clackety shoes. Am I in a good neighborhood? What sorts of signals am I giving off? Do I look like prey? Shit, is my lipstick too red? Fuck, I had two drinks and I'm buzzed. Oh god, all these mistakes I'm making just by living my life and owning a vagina while doing so.

    So this guy is walking towards me and I don't know him and it's late. Do I trust this stranger? Do I risk pissing him off by obviously crossing the street to avoid contact? What do I do, what do I do, shit he's coming closer....

    Oh. He crossed the street. Whew.
     
  9. sisterkathlouise

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    I think the term feminist comes with WAY too much baggage. The definition of the word is basically just a person who advocates for equal rights for women. I am cisgender, I am heterosexual, and Boyfriend and I have very heteronormative gender roles in our relationship. I even shave my armpits and (usually) wear bras. I also consider myself a feminist because I believe in and advocate for equal rights for women. I think more men should claim the term feminist because, in my opinion, there isn't a whole lot of ground between feminist and misogynist. But from what little I know about Nom and my loosey-goosey definition, I would consider him a feminist.
     
  10. ssycko

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    But what if there are two different women, each walking towards you on different sides of the street at night?
     
  11. Frebis

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    What if women are on both sides of the street? Should I turn around and go the opposite direction?
     
  12. Pinkcup

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    What if I told you that you could participate in an Internet discussion without being facetious?

    No, but seriously, there's no hard and fast rule. Just be aware of the immense pressure women are under when they're existing in a space that some might find "too risky" for them to operate in (in this case: on a street, alone, late at night). And be a good person (good feminist? Choose your own label) by being as non-threatening as possible. That's it. Whatever that means to you.
     
  13. sisterkathlouise

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    You guys seem really keen on invalidating the female experience and making fun of anyone who might make an effort not to. Nobody took any social sciences in college? Nobody had strong positive relationships with feminist women who imparted some knowledge and wisdom? Fuck.
     
  14. ssycko

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    If by "really keen on invalidating the female experience," you mean "writing on a board that has the tagline 'Where Intelligent Discourse and Depravity Meet'," you'd be right!
     
  15. MoreCowbell

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    Is it really that outrageous to say that, when it is very low cost to you, maybe you should make an effort to make women feel safe? I don't know whether crossing the street passes the point unreasonableness in a cost-benefit sense, but when I'm walking around late in the evening, I make a conscious effort to leave some space between myself and a woman who is walking alone, because there is no need to scare someone just so I get home 1 second faster.
     
  16. Pinkcup

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    But what if you and another hipster are both getting mustache tattoos on your index fingers? Whose terrible acoustic guitar song should I listen to first?

    BOOM ROASTED
     
  17. Noland

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    It's not so much that, it's more the automatic assumption that because we occupy the same relative space at the same point in time that we are potential rapists. I'll be honest and tell you I have never once considered that a woman might think I was a rapist because it was late and night and we were alone on the same street at the same time. Should I happen to remember it, I might walk on the other side of the street, but chances are, since I'm not raping anyone, the thought that she might think I would isn't going to cross my mind.

    In answer to your other questions, no I took no social sciences and my mother owns an extremely well read first edition copy of The Feminine Mystique and what she imparted to me was what I posted on the first page: Treat women like adult human beings.

    Oddly enough it's the same advice my father gave me.
     
  18. wexton

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    I must really know the wrong women if walking alone is that big a deal all the time.
     
  19. Crown Royal

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    [​IMG]

    Seriously, there are easy steps guys could take to not make a woman feel uneasy. I'm not going to cross the street, but I'll give them space on the sidewalk, at least try to give the impression I'm not Mr. Boogity. If I'm walking up behind a female, I won't speed up or cackle loudly with laughter or whatnot. I doubt there are many women out there who love the sound of mysterious footsteps sneaking up on them while they're half-lit at 3am.
     
  20. sisterkathlouise

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    I'm not arguing that to be an OK guy you have to walk across the street every time a woman walks by at night. But the IMMEDIATE reaction of most people on this board, both to the article and to pinkcup's posts, was to invalidate and berate. You treat women like adult human beings, great, but it might also not be a bad thing to understand some of the fear and invalidation that women deal with every day. Because not all men treat women like adult human beings, and not all men aren't rapists.
     
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