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The Association: 2012-2013

Discussion in 'Sports Board' started by Trakiel, Oct 17, 2012.

  1. Trakiel

    Trakiel
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    Call me Caitlyn. Got any cake?

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    So does Shaq actually serve any purpose on TNT's studio show? He just sits around and never says anything. Why is he even there?

    I'd talk about actual basketball, but I'm kind of speechless regarding my team. Guys keep going down at a pace that's just completely surreal. Wolves are now out:

    Love (starter)
    Rubio (starter)
    Barea
    Roy (starter)
    Buddinger
    Pekovic (starter)

    I can't even get a good feel for the team because there hasn't been any opportunity for units to play together.
     
  2. Gator

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    Shaw is used to dominating the room, but every time he opens his mouth Barkley slams him. Now he doesnt know what to do.
     
  3. MoreCowbell

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    So what do you think the odds of Royce White playing playing in the NBA beyond this season are?
     
  4. Nom Chompsky

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    Why? D'Antoni isn't a bad defensive coach. He's not a good one either, but he's a pretty decent one.

    The Suns were in the middle of the pack in defensive efficiency pretty much every year, and it's not like they had great defenders across the board.
     
  5. Clutch

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    I think a lot of people unfairly shit on D'Antoni because his teams give up a lot of points. It's kind of a given that when you take less than 10 seconds off the shot clock the other team will also get more offensive possessions.
     
  6. MoreCowbell

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    I was watching the Knicks and Grizzlies last night and a few things popped out:

    1) Zach Randolph is the most boring semi-star of all time. I know everyone always talks about how he gets a "quiet 20 points/15 rebounds" but it still shocks me every single time. How do you put up those kind of numbers on a regular basis without once making me think "Wow, that was a great play."

    2) Marc Gasol really needs to grow a pair. He has the tools to be the best center in the NBA. He's smart and careful with the ball, a great defender, a fantastic passer, hits free throws, is a good natural rebounder... but he is just too damn timid. This guy should be averaging something like 24 and 11 while shooting 54%.

    Instead, he settles for shitty 7 foot turnaround jumpers and hooks, and doesn't get in good offensive rebounding position. It's really frustrating to watch someone who should be great settle to be merely pretty good out of a misguided sense of being a team player and a lack of gumption.

    3) Hoooly shit the way the NBA is refereeing player behavior is completely out of hand. It's gotten to the point where "He looked at me funny" is getting t'd up. The referees are grown men, whose only job is to make sure the game is played smoothly. The idea that they need to be coddled like this from those rude, uncouth players is absurd.

    They gave Rasheed a technical because he ran away from the play after the call, without even saying anything. If the 1980s or 1990s had been officiated this way, players like Payton, Sir Charles, or Shaq would have gotten two technicals by halftime every single game.
     
  7. Parker

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    Knicks players came out and said they went weeks (plural) without talking about, talking about, yes he said talking about, let alone practicing - defense. That makes you a bad defensive coach. Not bringing in defensive players when you had a major say in personnel decisions, makes you a bad offensive coach. When teams are going +15 on their average on you, makes you a bad defensive coach. D'Antoni gets fired and now the Knicks are 6-0, primarily because everyone is playing defense. The other things with D'Antoni that make him bad for the Lakers: He plays a VERY short bench. 7.5 guys at most, with maybe one other person getting 5-7 minutes a game. That's not going to work with the oldest backcourt (already suffering/recovering from injuries) in the league, MWP's slow feet, and Dwight Howard coming off back surgery. Those guys can't sustain those minutes.

    I'm going to predict here that Pau Gasol gets traded to New Orleans for Ryan Anderson, and another piece. Pau and Howard can't exist in D'Antoni's system unless he changes it.
     
  8. MoreCowbell

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    It doesn't matter, really: no one on the Lakers can play the "D'Antoni system." Kobe, Gasol, MWP, and Nash are all too old to run like that, and with the exception of Nash, none of them have ever had styles of play that fit into the "D'Antoni system." Ramon Sessions could have, but he's gone. Moving Gasol would not fix that problem. If he tries to make the Lakers play like the old Suns, he's going to have an even worse case of square-peg-in-round-hole than he did with the Melo-STAT-Chandler Knicks. Kobe and Howard are guys made for the half court.

    He ought to be molding a halfcourt-set-based team based on players who have insanely high basketball IQs, similar to San Antonio or Dallas teams of a few years ago. Medium-pace with smart shots and good ball movement, defense solid but not smothering through everyone knowing their jobs. That's really the only style of play this team has the roster for. The problem will be that they appear to have a bench full of untalented knuckleheads. Consider me thoroughly unconvinced that he's the man for that team.
     
  9. Parker

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    I think we're arriving at the same point from two different directions. Also, not saying moving Pau is going to help them. I'm just saying, its going to happen unless he drastically alters his system. Which he won't. Like Adam Carolla says, you put beavers at the top of the Empire State Building, they're going to start looking for wood to build a dam.
     
  10. Nom Chompsky

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    This is incorrect. There's a reason I used D'Antoni's defensive efficiency in Phoenix -- it's a much better metric to gauge how well a team is playing defense, because pace plays a huge role.

    They were also first in Offensive Efficiency. The Knicks are playing well on both ends of the court.

    Source?


    I never said D'Antoni was a good defensive coach. He's not. But for years his teams were middle of the pack in Defensive Efficiency (13-17th). The numbers aren't there to back up the argument that he's not capable of being a perfectly fine defensive coach.
     
  11. MoreCowbell

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    OK, but the Knicks under D'Antoni were consistently in the mid to lower 20s in defensive efficiency, with an average of about 25th. And that's including the periods of time where Tyson Chandler played for him.

    I'm looking for a source but I read that exact same thing about their practice/gameplanning time somewhere, attributed to anonymous Knicks' player/s.

    Looking at the advanced stats, I think it might be the case that Shawn Marion is a much better defender than anyone gives him credit for, because that's the only explanation for those Phoenix teams coming out as "mediocre" given their makeup (i.e. Joe Johnson, Amare, Nash, Diaw, Marbury, QRich, Barbosa). Like, best-perimeter-defender-of-his-generation, Hall of Fame level good. Because he already is sixth in defensive win shares among active players, and among perimeter players he is behind only Kidd, who has five more years under his belt. This is despite the bleed over of defensively inept teammates and D'Antoni.
     
  12. Parker

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    Can't find the source now as I'm on my phone, but it was either Bill Simmons, Zach Lowe, or Jalen Rose. Probably Jalen Rose, who also echoed that sentiment since he played for him in 2007.
     
  13. Gator

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    Getting all set for the big TNT matchup tonight Heat vs Spurs.

    Heat havent played since Saturday. This is their first big opponent in a while.

    What do I just read? Duncan, Parker & Ginobli did not even make the trip to Miami after their game last night in Orlando.

    Im glad I didnt pay money to go to this game. Thats some bullshit right there.
     
  14. Parker

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    I'm considering the NBA still in Pre-Season until Derrick Rose comes back. It must be pre-season, Nate Robinson really isn't on the Bulls.

    /endpatheticdenial
     
  15. MoreCowbell

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    While I don't want to be bandwagonning here, I have to admit the new Nets are looking damn good. They're actually getting passable defense out of DWill and Joe Johnson (DWill is typically among the worst defensive point guards) and very high quality performance on both ends out of their forwards. I don't really understand how Brook Lopez's numbers are so good: the guy looks like a complete idiot on offense every time I watch them (Burn seven seconds of clock trying to back down Tyson Chandler? Sure! Or I could lower my head for a kamikaze drive at the hoop!). They're looking pretty good for a team that whiffed on it's big off-season target.
     
  16. MoreCowbell

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    It gets weirder: Stern is saying there will be "sanctions" (I'm curious how he'll end up justifying this when Pop insists it is for his older players' health) and somehow, the Spurs are winning.
     
  17. Trakiel

    Trakiel
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    Call me Caitlyn. Got any cake?

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    That's some bullshit right there. So scrub teams can tank for a better lottery position with no repercussions, but a contender isn't allowed to make decisions that it believes will be beneficial in the long run because "ruining" a marquee matchup? Is this the NBA or WWE?
     
  18. Clutch

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    How would this have played out if they were on the injury report with vague injuries? Is Stern going to decide if Duncan's back is sore enough to sit out? What if the Spurs had won? Stern had already promised to punish a team for pursuing a strategy that isn't television-friendly. What's next, fans like dunks, so does he start fining teams that don't dunk enough? MLB teams give guys the day off all the time, and there isn't any uproar from fans who really wanted to see a certain guy play.
     
  19. Gator

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    You cant totally devalue the regular season like that. It hurts TV ratings and ticket sales.

    I agree coaches should be allowed to run their team and Im not sure where you draw the line, but pulling all your stars and not telling anybody until 2 hours before the game has to be dealt with.
     
  20. Clutch

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    The NBA regular season has almost no value to begin with. Teams with losing records make the playoffs, and road teams in the first round rarely have any real chance.