The town I live in initiated a smoking ban a little over a year ago. Bar owners were especially angry and bitched constantly, usually via passive aggressive signs. The town council, after six months of bitching at meetings, lifted the ban for bars that only serve people over 21. The result? 1 bar stayed non-smoking and their business doubled (his signs quickly changed from town council bashing to thanking the non-smoking community for their support). The rest reverted back to smoking bars. Now, six months later, one of the smoking bars lost so much business it closed, and the owner was complaining to his few remaining regulars that the smoking ban drove customers to the non-smoking bar (which was still thriving), and killed his business. According to a friend that went there and was friends with the owner, the guy blames the non-smoking bar for not reverting after the ban was lifted for bars. The moral of the story? Know your customer base. People in our town wanted non-smoking bars. When there was only one non-smoking bar in town, it became the place to be, and the smoking bars lost business. They were more concerned with being political about the issue than thinking about their business, and it hurt them in the long run.
I smoked on and off for 20 years. A little more than a pack a day, first Camels, then American Spirits, and finally Marlboro. I love smoking and if it wasn't so damn bad for me I'd still be puffing happily away. I miss the social aspect of the smoking area at work and even had a little fling with a woman I met there. I also miss breaking up my day and I now go for a walk every 90 minutes. I quit ten months into sobriety and it was easier than before for a couple of reasons. First was that I was able to apply some of the AA principles to quitting. Second was that in the halls of my local AA quitting, smoking is second only to quitting drinking in terms of the rah-rah effect. The third is I stopped ingesting opiates when I got sober and for some reason ciggys taste AWESOME when I'm high on the poppy. I don't care of people smoke, its their decision. Am I jealous ? You bet as the only thing I ingest thats really bad for me is sodium and gf has been weaning me off that too.
Exactly. As far as I'm concerned, smoking is just a downright stupid decision. I've heard every excuse in the book and they all come down to someone who doesn't have the brain power to make a decision that honors our species' so called intelligence. Don't even get me started on the broken logic used by every "die young" retard out there. At the most basic level, I don't have the slightest urge to add that kind of routine to my life (smoking, smoke breaks etc). After that, I also don't have an interest in spending $6-$15 a day on a "stress reliever" (What the fuck is stress?). Then there's the limitations of smoking on my physical abilities. Then there's tasting like a horse's ass when making out (and smelling like shit). Finally, there's being a nuisance for the rest of society who managed to make better decisions than I did. Oh and I forgot about CANCER. A couple years ago, smoking caught up with one of my step uncles. He was in his late forties. He suffered for almost a year in a hospital before he finally passed. It was the worst sight I have ever seen. But you know what really sucked? The teenage daughters he left behind and his wife. I'm not going to preach to the choir here, but it was a heartbreaking experience for everyone involved. I don't have any friends that smoke. I certainly don't think I ever will. If someone does not care about their OWN wellbeing, what chance is there that they will care about mine? I don't care to hear about how you're an exception and that you're loyal and actually really smart and make 6 figures working at a fortune 500 engineering firm. Where it matters most, you are a shortsighted/arrogant idiot. And you smell bad.
I've been smoking for close to 35 years. I know I need to quit, but I just haven't gotten the motivation to put a plan into action. Like any other addiction, I continue to rationalize it and live in my delusion. I've been in the pre-contemplation stage of change regarding quitting for about two years now. Yeah, smoking is bad, it's linked to variety of illnesses, etc., etc. But here are some of the issues I have: 1. Sin tax: A great idea. Increase the cost to deter use, generate revenue to fund other programs (e.g., education). But, be fair and apply the same standard to other consumables that negatively impact health, like junk food. Do you think diabetes levels are skyrocketing because there's something in the water? 20 million American have diabetes, and another 40 million are pre-diabetic (early type-2). Childhood obesity has more than tripled in the past 30 years. According to the CDC, nearly 20% of kids 6-11 are obese, 18% of 12-18 year olds. These kids will put more of a strain on healthcare because they'll be tapping resources earlier in life to combat any of the numerous complications stemming from their obesity Start taxing the hell out of junk food. And while you're at it, disallow the use of food stamps to buy this shit, too. You can't get smokes or beer with them, apply the same standard. 2. Second-hand smoke: I agree with the no-smoking policy inside public buildings (bars, I don't agree with--it should be up to the owner's discretion). But banning it anywhere outside? Unless you drive an electric car, pedal a bike, or hoof it everywhere, shove that argument up your ass. Designated smoking area around public buildings have been established and in my experience, it seems to be working fine. And now, I'm going to go check to see if it still is.
I hate the smell of smoke personally, so I prefer not to be around it. If you want to smoke, fine, just don't do it near me. The biggest thing I hate is when someone will light a cigarette at a table behind me and then hold it at an angle behind their back so it doesn't get smoke in their face, but it will waft right into my face. Fuck, that pisses me off. We have a friend that smokes like a chimney, and he apparently never learned how to smoke without getting it all over himself, so he constantly reeked of it. We tried to get him to stop because of that, but because he is a good friend and I would hate to see smoking kill him. He was in town this weekend and is doing a great job of quitting which is good, although I have a feeling he is spending a small fortune on nicotine gum. Here in Oklahoma it is still the owners choice on whether or not to allow smoking in a bar. Restaurants and all other buildings are off limits, but there are lots of bars around here in which you can still smoke, which I think is just fine. I understand that people want to smoke when they drink and so if that's what they want then they can go to a bar that allows it. If I don't want to be around smoking, then I'll go to a smoke free bar. There are plenty of both around and I think it's a perfectly acceptable arrangement, it actually surprises me that some places outright ban smoking in all bars. I do know that I am prone to addiction and don't have the willpower to quite, so thank God I never started smoking. My drinking habits are bad enough.
I think banning smoking in some outdoor places should be acceptable. Just random outdoor areas, no. Places like parks, outdoor malls, the space right around main building entrances, festivals or fairs, etc are justifiable. Places where people will actually gather just like they would indoors.
Both smokers and non smokers have to stop bitching. As a smoker, I dont mind having places like restaurants, bars etc. having you take it outside. I never tried to bother anyone with my smoking and I never will. However, I disagree with with someone shoving their nose into somebody else's shit and telling them they don't have the right to allow smoking in a place that they OWN and have all free rights to. That just plain isn't right, and it doesn't matter what your opinion on it is. One more thing: enough with moving smoking areas away from entrances. The second you step outside you are already being poisoned by the near two billion cars on this planet, so way to put a bandaid over a shotgun wound. It is nothing more than the illusion of public concern.
I come from a family (both sides) of heavy smokers, including an uncle that died in his forties to lung cancer, somehow I'm one of like 4 cousins (out of around 40) that never picked up the habit. I have an extremely sensitive sense of smell and cigarette smoke sets me right the fuck off, I use to not go to bars and parties because of it(not skipping them altogether, but I'd often get in a mood to not want to deal with the smell), so on a personal level I love all these smoking bans and hope they continue on. Ideologically though (as has been pointed out already) I think it's stupid to tell a bar owner that he can't allow people to smoke in their establishment, IT'S THEIR FUCKING BUILDING, THEY AREN'T GRABBING PEOPLE OFF THE STREET MAKING THEM SIT THERE. If enough people really wanted smoke free bars, there would have been a market for it before the bans. I remember there was one bar in NH I went to that had a non-smoking section and it was always dead. On another note, does anyone find it funny that I can drink beer in a bar but can't smoke, but I can smoke on the sidewalk but can't drink a beer? Fucked up I say! Agreed, I would never date a smoker, honestly I don't think I'd date an ex smoker either since every single person I know that has quit either picks the habit back up or at the very least has a cigarette or two now and then.
Random question, anyone know of anyone that picked up the habit after the age of say 23? It shows you how stupid it is when you realize just about every smoker picked up the habit when they were a dumb teenager.
I was a "light" smoker (3-5 cigs a day) for about six years and loved it. However, I did smoke a pack a day during my mandatory military service and absolutely hated it. It tasted like shit but it was the only thing keeping me sane.* I quit my daily habit 1,5 years ago. Occasionally I still enjoy a nice cigar though. Anyway, I'm sure most smokers and ex-smokers can surely agree, that enjoying a cigarette after sex, a good meal or with booze delivers a face-rocking-awesome feeling. God, I miss that a lot. When it comes to indoor smoking bans, they are okay in my book. For reasons unknown, I absolutely HATED smoking indoors. It just felt all sorts of wrong. People smoking in restaurants (where possible) are assholes. And here is another conflicting concept: chicks who smoke can be sexy as hell and disgust me at the same time. Because who likes making out with an ashtray? Yeah... *I'm not a fucking anti-military hippie, I'm against for forcing people to do it.
Similarly, at one of the Indian casinos in Oklahoma, you can drink at the bar, but you can't smoke, and you can smoke at the gaming tables, but you can't drink.
My concern with smoking right outside the entrance to a building has nothing to do with second hand smoke or the health impact associated with it. My thing is that I don't want to leave a building and only to be instantly greeted with a cloud of smoke, not because I'm afraid that second hand smoke will kill me, but because I don't like cigarette smoke. Also, I think it should only really apply to main or heavily used entrances to a building. You don't want me to stand right outside the entrance to your place of work or whatever and rip nasty, apple juice farts all day, do you?
I love how people are complaining that beyond cigarettes being taxed, it's unfair because we're just as much of a strain on the healthcare system for our eating habits and that maybe fast food and unhealthy menu items should be taxed, as if you guys aren't a part of that problem too. I don't know too many smokers who eat a sustainable, local, fresh and balanced diet. QueenBee? BigPersonwhatever, anyone else care to chime in? Are you overweight? Is your health, beyond what smoking affects, in perfect shape? How much fast food do you eat? Processed food? Would you say you're a part of that problem too? I'd bet good money you are. But that's of course besides the point. We're talking about smokers' rights. Everything is so unfair. You guys want to flip the argument and apply the stigma and government control on smoking to other things? Go ahead, but I have a sneaking suspicion that if you got your way you would only complain more, as you're a part of that problem too. Fuckin' government, meddling in my affairs! My grandfather didn't die face down in Normandy so some cottage cheese eatin' pussy can tell me I can't smoke my Marlboro while eating my now $3 McDouble. I can't stress this enough, I don't give a fuck what you guys do. I literally care more about properly cutting my toenails so I don't get an ingrown than I do about someone smoking. It's just not something I care to waste energy on. What bothers me if you guys feeling you have the right to complain about anything. Just because you used to be able to do something (smoke everywhere) and now you can't, doesn't mean anything. I'd like to think that when obviously negative things are changed, by law, more often than not it's for the betterment of EVERYONE, so the minority who chooses to voluntarily partake in said shitty endeavor can take a long walk off a short dock. Some people used to love segregation. Business owners thought it was their right to maintain it. Being racist isn't illegal. People complained that it's always been this way, why rattle the cage? "They have their spots, we have ours, just let us be!" Hell, at least they give you guys the option to go smoke on a patio or outside. That's compromise. Can you imagine seeing a designated racist porch? Or you have to walk by a couple people hurling racial insults to get into the front of a restaurant? Does me making this exaggerated comparison help highlight a little but of the logic? Ring any bells? I sincerely hope that some of you get so stressed by reading this thread that you have to go burn one. Maybe that can be a wake up call.
I started smoking in 2007, and although I know the dangers and also consider myself fairly intelligent, some days you really don't give a fuck. Spoilered for rant and I don't want to bore anyone (although it is part of why I started smoking daily, so it is on topic): Spoiler About two weeks after my mother was first diagnosed with liver cancer (which she is still going through chemo for after various treatments and surgeries) I was woken up at 8am by a knock at my bedroom door. Two police were there, and asked me to come downstairs. When I arrived, there were several more uniformed police and two detectives, who informed us our house was being "raided" due to my brother (whom I've mentioned previously is an addict and has severe drug induced psychosis - funnily enough this is also still an issue) being linked to several burglaries and an assault in the neighborhood. I comforted mum, and left her with one of the officers while I showed the rest of them through the house, pointing out items I hadn't seen before. This is in combination with finishing work at 6am that morning, and having an exam at 4pm that day (I'd planned to sleep during the day so I could be fresh for it). Skip to my mother crying into my shoulder, with my brother's utterly carefree look on his face, without even saying a word to her. It was either go outside for a cigarette (my dad always had a spare pack lying around) or have more than half a dozen cops witness to assault occasioning grievous bodily harm. I chose the former. Needless to say I failed that exam. On that note, I'm going to finish my scotch with a cigarette on the balcony. Edit: I started smoking when I was 20, for a reference of maturity.
I honestly can't tell if you're trolling but: You'd be surprised at the number of vegans and vegetarians that are smokers. So if the existence of drinking, TV, porn and junk food made 51% of people uncomfortable, we should ban them all? But that's the thing THEY (business owners) want to let you smoke inside, but they're not allowed to let you by law. And if you want to correlate smoking with racism, then anyone who smokes where they're not suppose to is the next Rosa Parks.
I have to ask, how old are you vex? I'm banking on 17 at the oldest. I find it funny that you won't be friends with people that smoke. Sometimes people think I'm too harsh because I refuse to associate with anyone that regularly abuses prescription pills. But I must know, do you have friends that drink, use drugs, or eat fast food?
I'm only 20 myself, and I've been smoking since I was 19. As such, I really can't make myself give a shit about smoking bans. I'm young enough that an Indian casino is the only establishment I've ever smoked in. I have moved on to an electronic cigarette, which I'm partial to. In about two weeks, I cut my cigarette consumption by more than half, and I no only take my pack off the back porch if I'm going to be drinking. While I hesitate to say that electronic cigarettes are healthier since the studies are ongoing, my solution is 24 mg of nicotine in some form of glycerol, and nicotine itself is far less dangerous than the chemicals you find in tar. Not to mention how cheap they are comparatively.
What's the deal with equivocating the health care burden of smoking with the health care burden of fast food? Do you guys know how much a month's supply of inhalers for COPD costs? Increased ER visits? Chemotherapy? If obesity costs more than smoking, it is simply because fewer people smoke than are obese these days. Standard inhalers for COPD are $120 / month in Canada, and this is the land of cheap brand name drugs. Only the most expensive medications for diabetes (and high blood pressure, and cholesterol) come close to costing that much. And chemotherapy, as the French say, is not cheap. As for me, while the smoking bans probably are intruding too much on private enterprise, I like them. I like that I can go into any restaurant or bar and not worry about my clothes stinking the next day. And at the end of the day, it's all about me. I think smoking is best summed up by philalaywer: I would be all over it were it not for, you know, the cancer and COPD and killing your physical fitness and the expense. And then wanting to have a smoke in a place you couldn't would suck as well. In any case, Bertrand Russell smoked a pipe all day and every day unless he was eating or sleeping. He lived until 97. Maybe I should just smoke pipes instead.
I'm in my twenties. My previous post probably needs clarification. It's not that I won't be friends with people who smoke, it's that it hasn't ever happened. None of the people I've been close to have ever had or picked up the habit. Whether you want to twist that one way or the other, I think the attributes I appreciate most in people are the same attributes that would help them choose not to smoke. I only have a few close friends and they drink socially, don't do drugs anymore (they smoked weed once upon a time), and we all eat healthy and stay active. However, this is a very small sample. Ultimately, I'm not nearly as narrow minded as this discussion would suggest. I'm not going to stop talking to someone once I discover that they smoke. But I do believe that smoking has no redeeming qualities or advantages and that's got to make me wonder about the people who engage in the activity. This is the same line of thought that makes it very likely that I won't be friends with someone who drinks and drives, or the kid who just bought a 52" TV instead of paying for the child support he's 6 months late on for the child he sired at 19 with a random. What about someone who cheats on their significant other? In my opinion, these are all actions that originate from who you really are, how you think and what your priorities are. I don't feel nearly as strongly about smoking as I do about the other examples I brought up. Smoking just happens to be the focus of this thread. I went overboard with the conclusion of my first post in this thread, sorry. I'd revise it to say something like "smokers aren't necessarily all idiots, but their habit seems to suggest that they may have poor long term decision making and/or will power."