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Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Nettdata, Nov 13, 2015.
France seems to be going through some shit.
Lafayette and George Washington
I really have no words right now.
Fucking Friday 13th.
Some seriously strong language coming from the leaders of France. "There will be a remorseless response". Signed HMFIC France. "Remorseless, pitiless" Words that we call in the business fighting words.
The coordination and sophistication (timing, logistic chain to get the weaponry used) harkens back to the bad days of Al-Queada. It will be interesting to see what France finds when the dust settles. Unfortunately it seems that their intelligence knew something big was coming they just didn't have anything solid to take action on.
Having worked with in a limited extent with the French, they are really not ones you want to piss off.
I've read quite a number of books by Navy SEALS, and to man they all said after doing joint training with French Special Forces that they are a seriously dangerous, determined, and well trained unit. Hopefully they turn them loose and let them fuck some shit up.
Does anyone have a reference for what I can only guess is a stupid question: why? What is it that motivates the terrorists? Is it pure "eradicate the world of all other religions?" Or is it poverty? What makes them take up arms and act?
I have no solid sources but there were witnesses that said the terrorists were blaming these actions on the events in Syria.
Again, that's nothing confirmed.
Initial reports are that ISIS has taken responsibility for the attack and there were some reports that one of the attackers taken into custody was Syrian (I read that here, it's a live feed article and can't find the exact text now): http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...227/Paris-shooting-Many-feared-dead-live.html
The exact motive to the attack is not clear yet but this initial information can lead you toward a general idea.
EDIT: Found it: "According to French channel BFMTV, one of the gunmen at Bataclan shouted: "It's for Syria" and "Allahu Akbar". There were also reports the attackers mentioned France's military actions in Syria."
My understanding, however basic ("'Murica!! USA! USA!!"), is that they hate what we stand for. Freedom of speech, freedom of religion, women's rights. That women are allowed to dress in ways they disagree with. That our governments are democracies. They don't like that we, as individuals, have the freedom to choose what we do, how, and when. They see it as evil, and they want to punish us for it.
**edit** When you said "the terrorists" I thought you meant terrorists in general, rather than these specific terrorists in France.
Vine of the soccer game where you can hear one of the explosions.
It will depend a lot on which group is saddled with the responsibility of these attacks. The French are pretty active on the African Continent, as well actions in the Middle East, a lot of different groups that may have an ax to grind.
To discuss the major player in the ME. One of the core tenets of ISIS or Daesh, or whatever you wish to call them is to bring about a final war between the West and Islam. A final Crusade if you will. This final battle is prophesized to take place in a small town in Syria called Dabiq. Of course, the West will lose this battle and the World Caliphate will be established and Allah's will will be the rule of peace and prosperity. The intent to bring this about establishes the wide window of violence that we see this group operate with.
But any terrorist group that works knows that that they cannot impose their will on major world powers. Insurgencies have always known that the soft underbelly of these powers is the will of their citizens. If you can instill fear there, you can force the hand and establish credibility for yourself.
These people that commit these acts though at their core believe themselves freedom fighters and genuinely fighting to ensure their way of life. This grander ideal makes people do some major things.
Exactly the Nazi's plan during WWII with the bombing of London. They seriously underestimated the resolve of the British people. They thought the general populace would be so discouraged when bombs started falling on them, they'd pressure the government to make it stop.
Obviously, it didn't work then and I doubt it's going to work now.
I hate to think of ours and our allied troops having to deal with this crap, but I think it's time.
It'll be interesting to see what effect this may have on Trudeau's resolve to pull out of Syria.
Doesn't France still own y'all? What choice in the matter does he have then?
I find this logic suspiciously and naively self-serving, the political equivalent of calling the terrorists "haterz."
I think terrorists tend to be be profoundly evil and self-centered people who prey on a combination of poverty and religiosity to codify their own power, with no ultimate plans of ever giving it up.
I think its two-fold. There is a fundamental distance between the culture and beliefs of the West and an Islamic state under the rule of a Caliph. That is a truth. This a radical and blood thirsty branch of Islam who is evil and overstretch their core message. Some are just evil people but ISIS is trying to push a way of life beyond just chaos. Now again, this is a radical branch and in no way should be used as some stupid blanket commentary on Islam, just like Westboro shouldn't besmirch Christianity in general.
As for the French Special Forces, all the military jokes about France overshadow the badass nature of those guys. I happened to be in Paris for Independence Day last year, which is a big military exposition downtown, and they were impressive and very cool to talk to about. I expect retaliation to be swift and brutal.
Poverty has nothing to do with it. See: Osama Bin Laden.
Other then that, yes: Evil, self centered, and religion.
Picture being a normal 15-25 year old male growing up in a sexually repressed community. Any woman who shows more then her eyes is a harlot and deserves death. If, God forbid, she's raped...she brought dishonor to her family and she needs to die to save the family's honor.
But there is an out...non believer women are fair game. Raping them, holding them as slaves, that's all fair game because they're non believers.
The non believer males? Fair game also. Whatever you do to them is for the greater glory of the religion.
And if you happen to die while serving the religion? You're a martyr and there's a plethora of virgins waiting to welcome you to paradise.
Yeah, as a normal, horny, young man I could see where that might be an enticement to follow this path.
But poverty? Nope. That's not going to drive a young man into a "Religious" furor. At 15-25 years old all you want to do is stick your dick in something and the promise that if you fail in this life, there's all sorts of virgins wanting to sit on your dick in the afterlife is pretty damned appealing.
They've been at this for thousands of years and have it down to an art.
Yeah, and I don't remember him killing himself for the cause.
Thank you for setting me straight and putting me in my place with a clear, concise and factual rebuttal that poverty is the root cause of terrorism.
I left Paris 2 weeks ago. Weird enough, when visiting I saw the army dudes with their machine guns patrolling, and I thought "Shit, something feels imminent." Though they're always around the tourists traps. I have a lot of opinions right now, none of them PC, none of them tasteful. Go hug someone.