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I don't want you, I just want your sperm!

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Kampf Trinker, Oct 19, 2014.

  1. Kampf Trinker

    Kampf Trinker
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    I recently caught the second half of a CNN special on the development of genius sperm banks. The concept is quite simple and is explained here. So if you were a lonely woman with a ticking biological clock and you wanted the babies of an athletic 6'2 neurosurgeon who looks like Brad Pitt and has an IQ of 160, you could in theory have just that.

    When these selection methods first appeared, it was naturally a political cluster fuck. However, the constant barrage of accusations ranging from godlessness to calling the developers neo nazis created awareness and the phones at these genius sperm banks started ringing off the hook. Did I ever mention how much I love irony?

    The segment I watched was done on the Repository for Germinal Choice, which closed doors in 1999. I'm still not sure how I feel about to concept itself. As I see it...

    Pros:
    - There are a lot of stupid people out there. Our gene pool could use some improvement.
    - This method is WAY better than women getting the sperm of some drug addict who can't hold down a job at McDonalds, and has to jerk off into a cup to afford his groceries.
    - I'm in favor of women taking sperm donations having a choice in the donor, and getting to know a little bit about him.

    Cons:
    - This is eugenics. I don't see anything barbaric or forceful about it, but choosing people based on a set of attributes with no consideration of personality or the person himself is still creepy to me.
    - Are some parents going to put unrealistic expectations on their kids? It's great if the father was a nobel prize winning physicist, but that doesn't mean your kid is going to go out and conqueror the world.
    - I grew up in China where parents frequently get rid of their baby daughters because they would rather invest in a son. I'd rather see infertile couples/single women adopt kids in those situations rather than combing over resumes.
    - It's not a problem now, but I could see in the future certain couples choosing not to procreate naturally and instead going after 'superior genetic material' so their kid has every possible opportunity. Again, creepiness factor.

    Focus: How do you feel about genius sperm banks? Eugenics in general? Is punching out God and blowing the proverbial load on his face just too much? Our human history with eugenics is ugly at best, but in the past this usually involved pathological hatreds rather than anything that made sense.

    Alt Focus: If you were infertile, or single into your mid 30s would you choose this option?
     
  2. Juice

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    I have a sperm bank of my own. Its an old T-shirt lying on the floor of my bedroom.

    Bump.
     
  3. Angel_1756

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    I'll play devil's advocate a bit.

    How is this different from a girl who only goes out and bangs hot professors? This just eliminates the banging portion. I'm not sure how sperm banks work, but I don't think it's luck of the draw, that you just get whatever sample you get. I think you get to select there as well, so all this business is doing is saving you the trouble of weeding through the dumbasses and ugly people.

    Realize that the donors aren't doing this against their will - they are knowingly, willingly and with full understanding of the process donating their sperm to this bank with the expectation of someone eventually birthing their progeny. I assume the "hot smart sperm bank" costs more money than the "everybody into the pool sperm bank", so maybe the donors are hedging their own bets, hoping that their potential children would be raised by someone with greater means than the average sperm bank user.

    My only complaint would be if it was a tiered system within the "hot smart sperm bank" where someone with an IQ > 140 costs more than someone with an IQ of 120, or whatever. I don't think it should be weighted like that.
     
  4. Jimmy James

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    Personally, I think it's snake oil. While there is some correlation between smart people and smart children, there are so many variables after birth that do more to shape people than some people realize. Yes, your 6'2" model/neurosurgeon is a hell of a catch, but you don't know that when he was 3, his mother was doing heroin in the bathroom of a gas station. After deciding he no longer wanted to be wearing clothes stolen out of a Goodwill, our model/neurosurgeon is now a workaholic with abandonment issues. It's horseshit.
     
  5. Crown Royal

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    Sometimes your kid turns out to be John Quincy Adams. Other times they turn out to be Jayden Smith. Genetics is a never-guaranteed crapshoot.
     
  6. Nersesian

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    If its not impacting me or mine, I don't have a problem with anyone doing anything that might bring them some degree of happiness. That said, I think this is less of an "issue" and more of a sales tactic for those looking to move some sperm. I don't realistically see how sperm brokers are able to verify the information let alone screen for those among us who are looking for a short term paycheck. You could have graduated MIT at the top of your class but be burdened with depression, anxiety and substance abuse. Is that perceived as "better" than someone with an average IQ working a production line who is happy with their lot in life? I guess this goes back to the nature vs. nurture debate which most likely won't be solved in this medium.

    I will say there would be a fair amount of schadenfreude if a well to do couple (or single lady person) spent X amount on what they perceived to be superior genetic material only to find their bundle of joy couldn't be happier in an 6x8 concrete home paid for by the state. I could just be a horrible person though.
     
  7. xrayvision

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    I don't actually see this as a eugenics thing because sperm banks already exist and there is good deal of information on each donor. (family medical history, race, occupation, etc.) People get to go in there in and choose what type of person they want to get sperm from. Just like people get to make a decision on the type of person they want to date, marry, have kids with, and so on. There was a case recently about a lesbian couple who were given the wrong sperm based on sloppy handwriting confusing the difference between the numbers 3 and 8. They received black guy sperm instead of white guy sperm and are now suing for wrongful birth. The case has merit, but the reasoning they listed is incredibly racist.

    I just see this as a way to make killer money off of shallow assholes. Just because this particular clinic will specialize in getting jizz from super successful people doesn't mean the kid is going to be all that special. Think of the upbringing this kid will have. Mommy and daddy(or whatever) are going to try and squeeze every dollar out of that vial with forced music and athletics, and any other kind of extracurricular you can think of. This isn't about the future of the kid. Its about the parents that want to live vicariously through their children's successes and have something to brag about at dinner parties.
     
  8. Parker

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    I feel like this is the actual core problem that all other evil intents aside, is going to happen. Hell, it already does. When two parents are doctors and their kid wants to be a comedian, they freak out. Doubly so coming from parents who moved from a shitty country to America. Also, like Angel said, it's not very different from how women select their mates now. I really don't see it being a problem outside of the fact we don't understand how nature vs nurture works. It'll be funny to see how this pans out as of course it'll get started, but its up to the market to deem how successful it is.
     
  9. Nom Chompsky

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    That's pretty unfair. He definitely has his flaws, but c'mon, the dude was President.
     
  10. CanisDirus

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    Basically, I see it kind of like trying to hedge your bets in the genetics lottery. But I've got no real beef with it. It does, however, seem a bit scammy to try and wrest more money for the ideal genius progeny. After all, as others here have pointed out, if I was a woman and I had the same set of values I do now, I'd be looking to have a kid who'd be happy and healthy.
     
  11. Angel_1756

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    Happy and healthy? Sure.
    But let's be honest here. I have a standard to maintain.
    [​IMG]
     
  12. toddamus

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  13. FreeCorps

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  14. Kampf Trinker

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    Just to be clear, the sperm bank I was talking about in the OP did thorough background checks and solicited people at their offices. In addition to the other requirements, they also look for people who had accomplishments, so people with natural ambition. Yes, life is still a crap shoot, but let's not be ridiculous and pretend the selection methods have no bearing on the kid's chances.

    That being said, after thinking about it more I fall firmly in the no camp. With all the options there are for having a kid I can't help but think most of the women going this route are having kids for the wrong reasons. They don't want to love and nurture someone, they're shitty parents who care about how their kid is going to make them look and them feel rather than what the kid wants. I'd rather have a kid who is happy and has a median income, than demand my kid be a successful lawyer in a career he hates just so I can brag about him. Also, the adoption issue is kind of a big thing for me. There's a kid you could help who could really benefit from growing up in a family rather than orphanage, but you're selfish and having a kid is more about you than the kid him/herself. Yes, this simplifies it, but don't bullshit me and pretend this isn't a core reason why the sperm bank had so many takers.

    Also, the guys who donate to this for their egos (and they are absolutely doing it for their egos) so they can have a bunch of kids running around they're never going to see is just fucking weird, and while I don't think women would be busting open the bank for my sperm it's the main reason I would never consider donating.
     
  15. CharlesJohnson

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    One of my best friends is a lesbian. So her and her wife have two options. Let one of their friends donate or they go to the sperm bank. Option one probably does not work for most people. If you see the donor all the time, that could get... complicated. Sperm banks are just fine*. Those individuals crafting a baby to suit their own agenda, other than the desire to simply have a child, are going to have children one way or the other. Also, just because these women go to fertility clinics, does not mean the sperm will take to the embryo on the first go. This method is not 100%, and as my friend saw, can get very expensive especially moving into en-vitro options.

    I won't worry about eugenics until we're procreating exclusively in some Huxley wet dream via test tube babies with a USA flag on each, and "Made In China" in fine print.


    *First one to mention adoption can fist fuck themselves. Why don't straight couples adopt more? Don't be ignorant, nobody wants a second hand baby.
     
  16. xrayvision

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    I think its an interesting concept a lucrative business idea. So you wouldn't use it or you don't want it to be available for other people to use?

    Because these people that are shitty that would use their children for the wrong reasons would already do that anyway, regardless of the source of the sperm. You can't be the personality police and stop shitty parenting. Adoption is a great thing but a lot of people also want to have their own children if they can conceive. I don't see how an elite sperm bank is really stopping anyone from doing anything they don't already want to do. It just seems to me that you would rather stop people from doing something that is perfectly legal because it makes you uncomfortable. Not that your rationale is wrong, but I think your reasoning for being in the "no" category is emotion based. Women sorting through donor types at any other sperm bank is the exact same thing, only this one doesn't have a bunch of shit people trying to get 50 bucks to go buy some whippets.
     
  17. CharlesJohnson

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    Reminds me of the Roald Dahl book nobody remembers. This is almost the plot of My Uncle Oswald.

    They manage to nab Einstein, Monet, Picasso, Matisse, James Joyce, and a shitload of Euro royalty.

    And I suddenly have an idea how to make $50 million by stealing a gallon of LeBron's and Bill Clinton's baby batter. Hell, Bill would probably be all for it depending on delivery method.
     
  18. Kampf Trinker

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    I meant no more as in I don't support it, not that I think it should be illegal. It's going to draw the parents I was talking about. I understand preferring your own over adoption, but having a stranger's kid you're never going to meet nor raise the child with isn't exactly natural either. Also, in the case of infertile couples I see adoption as by far more preferable, but that's purely a moral standpoint.

    I do agree that this is by far better than the older methods where sperm banks were based almost solely on looks and were full of donors with mental disorders or IQs in the 80s. And yes, my answer is somewhat based on emotion, but we're talking about having kids, not a financial portfolio.
     
  19. Juice

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    All you have to do is find Monica's blue dress and ring it out like a bar rag.

    I don't really care about this because I heavily favor nurture over nature so if people want to waste their money then so be it.
     
  20. The Village Idiot

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    Actually, it is eugenics, which you need information for, while eugenics is technically the 'study of improvement of the human race through selective breeding' - this is basically the same thing. People are going into the sperm bank seeking specific qualities as to what they want in a potential 'mate.' Then, based on that information, and analysis of what that person wants, they then choose which sperm donor they want, discarding other 'less desirable' traits.

    Now, before people get all wacky on me, people have been engaged in this behavior since there were people. Women want certain traits in men, men want certain traits in women. We date, we negotiate, and we reproduce, hoping that the offspring will have the most desirable traits of both parents.

    But like many things reduced to their most base form, when someone is choosing sperm donors, you miss out on a lot of potentially desirable traits because 1) you didn't think to ask, or 2) you were too focused on 'what you wanted.' Most of the really interesting people in life, including innovators, are a bit quirky. They may not conform to nice boxes that can be checked. In short, the wildcards that are not quantifiable may lead to a child that is wonderful, despite flawed parents (and I assure you, they are all flawed) or they may lead to children that are shit factories, despite perfect parents (which I assure you don't exist).

    In short, I don't like it. Should it be outlawed? No. But ultimately the process of dating and reproduction are geared towards (on a biological level) improving the species. This process subverts that.