Re: 9/19/14 WDT NSFW You didn't reference the student in your earlier post. You said "adults shouldn't be fucking 16 year olds", and I was replying to that statement.
Re: 9/19/14 WDT NSFW Doesn't really change my point, which is that the legality of the situation is immaterial. If a 32 year old banging a 16 year old is fucked up in one state, it's equally fucked up in a neighboring state even if the letter of the law makes one "ok."
Re: 9/19/14 WDT NSFW Now, when we say victim here? Do we mean that this student is currently suffering or going to future suffer from emotional/developmental/financial distress? Or do we mean that this student was on the receiving end of a criminal act regardless of the affect it had on them?
Re: 9/19/14 WDT NSFW All I know is I'd be just as pissed if it happened to my son as my daughters. And even if it's a case of both being legal, I believe teachers sign contracts about code of conduct. And they deserve jail just for being stupid thinking the boy wouldn't say something. Girls get a bad rap about running at the mouth, but in my experience, guys can be just as bad. Particularly when it comes to sex. I probably know way too much about my guy friends' sex lives. Isn't it a little too early to tell? And what if he was 14 and said he was cool with it? Would that matter? Where do you draw the line? Edit: because my phone is stupid (I don't really mean that)
Re: 9/19/14 WDT NSFW Maybe this kid isn't distraught at all; maybe he orchestrated the whole thing. Who knows. I guess the difference of opinion here is that I think it's entirely plausible that he was taken advantage of and that it wasn't totally consensual. This idea that teenage boys can't be raped "if she's hot" is ridiculous. And you know what, let's forget about the word rape - I mean I'm sure he could have physically fought them off if he wanted to, it's not like they forcibly held him down. But maybe they got him to do things he wasn't comfortable doing because he was afraid to say no; after all, what kind of a faggot wouldn't want to have a threesome with those two, right? If I had been molested/raped/taken advantage of/whatever, I think I would feel pretty shitty to see thousands of comments online congratulating me and offering up high fives over the incident. I don't think we should all automatically default to "Niiiiiice!" comments without having any real knowledge of the situation.
Re: 9/19/14 WDT NSFW That's your opinion, to which you're entitled. I respectfully disagree. Whoa. Want.
Re: 9/19/14 WDT NSFW I think each state has the right to decide which laws they think are fucked up or not. What if you changed the word "state" to the word "culture / country" in your statement?
Re: 9/19/14 WDT NSFW Well we'd know it wasn't a victimization if let's say he ended up marrying her, having 2.5 kids with her and are still happily married. Like that couple. I think its weird to use the word victim if the whole reason this thing blew up was because he was bragging to his friends. If something was dark, dirty and shameful, he wouldn't have said shit. Hell none of my friends admitted to beating off until 18-19 even though we were in the dawn of internet porn era. If they forced him into it, that's fucked up, but if he was making plays, I don't subscribe to the fact that he was too young to know what consent really is. You hear about 16 year olds that don't know how magnets work and then 16 year olds that are taking care of their families, working jobs, making sure their little siblings are getting to school etc for whatever reason. That logic just doesn't hold up if it is two 16 year olds are about to bang, at what age of the older person does the younger one not know what consent means? What it really comes down to is who idea was it at first. If it was his idea first, then the teachers should get some probation etc. If it was the teachers initiated it, then they should get some harsher punishments. Speaking of the age of consent, while on a beach in Puerto Rico, me and some friends could swear this group of (what we hoped were) busty 16 year old girls were teasing us. Lots of stretching, jumping up and down, toweling off etc while facing our direction and looking at us. It was really really strange. As we've been drinking all day, comments were made about the age of consent. How it's 16 in certain states yadda yadda yadda. I stopped pulled up on my phone to look up the age of consent in Puerto Rico. It's currently 16, but there is a bill moving through their system to move it to 14. That incited everyone to let loose a "wtf" comment and change topics.
Re: 9/19/14 WDT NSFW Louisiana has determined that 17 is the age of consent. Even had the kid been 18 there is a law prohibiting sex between students and teachers. So we can debate the morality all we like, but the law isn't always a moral thing. EDIT: It doesn't come down to that at all. Not even a little bit. Age of consent is that rarest of things in the law. It's a bright line. Again, regardless of this kid's age, there's still the student/teacher relationship to deal with.
Re: 9/19/14 WDT NSFW That two-16-year-olds analogy doesn't work at all, because we almost always make distinctions between adult-to-child conduct and child-to-child conduct. If I were to walk up to a child and smack him or her in the mouth, this would be treated very differently than if two kids of the same age got in a fight. Similarly, if I verbally harassed a teenager, everyone would want to know what the fuck was wrong with me, in a way they would not question two teenagers yelling at each other. If not 16, at what age do you find an adult banging a minor inherently distasteful, as opposed to situationally? There's no inherent reason for any particular age vs. another as the bright line and perhaps it is better thought of as a moral sliding scale rather than a binary, but would you be morally cool with, say, your brother banging a 16 year old girl? Wouldn't you sideeye the fuck out of him?
Re: 9/19/14 WDT NSFW That's too black/white. Now, let's be clear, I'm not saying student/minor fucking is right. Because if the minor who got smacked or yelled at walked away saying "That was cool, can't wait to tell my friends!" it has to be treated differently. I'm saying the punishment should be levied on the actual damage done to the of the younger person and saying the argument "that at 16, someone doesn't know what consent means" is absolutely ridiculous. I went to H.S. with a very attractive girl named Monique who was vocal about hooking up with older guys. "Oh Monique? You mean the girl who likes older dudes and not one of us in H.S. can get to her, yeah I know her." She went after this one teacher like fucking Ahab went after Moby Dick. Now what I am saying is that at 16 has been considered adult longer than it has been considered child in the course of time. I think in situations where the student is trying to pull some strings and make things happen should be looked at differently than the one where the student was the aggressor. The idea that the student CAN'T be the aggressor is unfair, illogical, and false. HOLY SHIT, I just facebooked then and they're goddamn married. HOLY SHIT. HAHAHAHA! Wow! With a kid. This is nuts. I just looked at this while typing it, holy shit. Nuts...we were all 99% sure before. Took me awhile to find her because she changed her last name to his. Now its confirmed. This shit definitely started when we were in our junior year putting her at 16/17...now, is she a victim? We graduated in 2004. That means they've been together for 10 years. Their kid looks to be 8 year old, and has a pretty rad mohawk. -Edits were made if anyone is confused.
Re: 9/19/14 WDT NSFW Can we then sentence a male 30 year old teacher to probation because the 16 year old female seduced him? Anybody that said that in mixed company would be rightly punched in the head for suggesting such a thing. We, and by we, I mean society, have a trust that we have with complete strangers to be in rooms by themselves with our children. We put this trust in these people because we want them to teach our children to be better people. Teachers fucking students is a violation of that trust. A teacher needs to be above reproach. Fair or not, they're going to be huge influences on the lives they are entrusted with. A kid that sees a teacher as a predator isn't going to want to learn. The last thing we need is more dummies polluting the gene pool.
Re: 9/19/14 WDT NSFW Doesn't matter who the aggressor is. Especially if you're a teacher, any answer other than "no" is wrong.
Re: 9/19/14 WDT NSFW Got some PMs, so going to elaborate on the Monique and teacher story. Jean-Jacques was the boys volleyball coach and also one of the special ed teacher. Very attractive guy at that. Monique early on commented on how she thought he was attractive, would go out of her way to talk to him. After a few months, she got quiet about it. Then at one point she said something about her boyfriend who no one ever met, because of course it was some old dude, called her Peanut. Her skin color was brown, she was also 4'11 with a huge ass. One time in the hallway, he is talking to her, they both head off to class, then about 20 feet away, he says "Hey, forgot to tell you something, Pea...uh..Monique!" Also, there were two other stories of these two cousins Ashley and Colleen, went AFTER a gym teacher. They'd request that he'd help them with their workout routines. They'd wear shorts with no underwear and do stretches and shit in front of him "Am I doing it right? Etc." Now something definitely went down, because he vanished. No word about anything in the news, press, and I definitely didn't hear anything from my parents. But that shit was crazy. Now I get the whole "We're trusting these people to protect our children, and they need to beyond reproach." But if the student goes after them, and they're still together happily every after 10 years later with children, should we not be making blanket statements? Just seems like a case by case basis would be more effective given there are already a huge range in punishments.
Re: 9/19/14 WDT NSFW So you wouldn't have fucked a teacher when you were in high school? I call fucking bull shit.
Re: 9/19/14 WDT NSFW High school me did a lot of dumb things. I would hope your bar is set higher than the actions of someone who thought Fight Club was the deepest movie ever made.
Re: 9/19/14 WDT NSFW My point is that no teacher should have fucked me. Regardless of how much I wanted it/asked for it/"was the aggressor."
Re: 9/19/14 WDT NSFW Well I agree with that! I'm just saying the punishment shouldn't be as harsh if the teacher isn't predatory. And saying the given the power dynamic of the student/teacher relationship, it's unfair to say they're always predatory. It's EASY, mentally/morally/psychologically to just say "Teachers by all account should never do that under any circumstance." But shit doesn't shake down like that. Because we need to be punishing for intent sometimes more than actual result on paper.