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#FHRITP

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Angel_1756, May 13, 2015.

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  1. Crown Royal

    Crown Royal
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    Just call me Topher

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    The mass majority of people who are not offended will always be completely and utterly overpowered by the few Munchausen-esque twats that ARE offended. And until we band together and say enough is enough, being offended is nothing and you're a whiney attention whore; we will sit there and allow them to determine our "proper" level of outrage.

    Wean these thin-skinned little bastards.
     
  2. Clutch

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    How much better would that video have been if the guy had been able to make a decent point.

    Reporter: Why did you do that?
    Guy: For this. I wanted to provoke this exact reaction, and you're giving it to me. I win.

    And do you suppose that the original guy she was interviewing just stood there and waited for her to come back? How unpleasant and awkward did that have to be for him? She was incredibly unprofessional in that respect.

    If you watch the video you can see that she knows about the meme. She says it happens 10 times a day and even calls it an outdated joke. She didn't feel threatened by the guy. She was frustrated and went on one of those impotent rants that everyone does when they snap, and those usually end with the frustrated person embarrassing themself. She got lucky because her target was too drunk and stupid to recognize what was going on and laugh at her frustration.
     
  3. The Village Idiot

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    Porn Worthy, Bitches

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    I looked like hell for a post I made years ago on a similar topic. Couldn't find it, so I'll reiterate the sentiments.

    Words are words. We don't live in a Harry Potter novel. There are no spells, people just want to believe in magic. Let me dispel that illusion here and now: there is no magic. You want to know the trick? See the ace up my sleeve? Ok, I'll show you.

    Words only have the power which the hearer gives them. That's it, and that's all. I know, you've heard a stirring speech. You've listened to a horrible person say the 'n' word. You've seen someone be 'disrespectful' and 'misogynistic' or whatever the fuck the flavor of the day is.

    Words only have the power the hearer gives them.

    I can try to insult you. I can try to inflame you. I can try to hurt you. But ultimately, if you want to be any of those things, that is your purview. Not mine. Good luck.
     
  4. Juice

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    We place social and cultural value on it because we place legal value on it, first and foremost. You have the right to do and say almost anything you want, which includes the right to act like an asshole if you want to, but you don't have the right to not be offended because who is going to define that? The guy got fired, so clearly society stepped in and regulated him, but there isnt and shouldnt be legal repercussions.
     
  5. Pinkcup

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    Not trying to be that person, but this entire thread minus Trakiel and lostalldoubt sounds like a bunch of man-children irritated by the erosion of their ability to push buttons and troll others sans consequence.

    Like it or not (and it's abundantly obvious you do not), the social landscape has changed. It's not okay to tell a woman to "toughen up, buttercup" when she's harassed at work anymore. No one gives a fuck if you were "just joking" or "it's a meme!" or "Jesus Christ, she really shouldn't be offended at this tiny small joke that I find hilarious but many others find uncomfortable and sexist." Companies recognize this shift in social consciousness and are reacting accordingly. Moan and groan all you like, but this kind of behavior isn't okay anymore.

    Actually, it wasn't ever okay. But thankfully, enough people who recognize this are now exercising their voices and authority and have effectively changed the tolerance level for this sort of nonsense.

    Okay, go back to griping.
     
  6. The Village Idiot

    The Village Idiot
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    Yes, the social landscape has changed. That's exactly the point many people are making, but of course, you come in here, on your high horse, and declare everyone that doesn't believe what you believe to be 'a man child.' In short, go fuck yourself. Offended? I hope so.

    The reality is we are being fed this glorified idea that somehow life shouldn't have any conflict or anything we find 'objectionable.' Whatever the fuck that means. You know what? I find your speech fucking objectionable. My position is very well thought out and articulated and you've just reduced it to 'man child status.' I'm fucking offended. Repent. Or there will be consequences. Like loss of your job, the derision of your family by neighbors. Civil actions. Maybe criminal ones. But please, tell me I'm awful. Let's all get on the political correctness train. I'd love to buy a ticket, but I have no idea where it goes.

    Actually, I know exactly where it goes, and it ain't good.

    Food for thought: the next time you think 'Wow, everyone knows what decency is!' Think again.
     
  7. Nettdata

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    Actually, it IS ok to tell a woman to "toughen up". Case in point, we have a female director at my company who takes every management discussion you have with her very personally. If something is raised, and you do not agree 100% with her, she takes it personally, has no ability or desire to compromise at all, and in the end, leaves the management meeting crying because we don't agree with her. It is a very civil, professional discussion, except for her.

    Guess what... she needs to toughen up, don't take shit personally, and learn to have a discussion like a mature adult.

    But wait... we're not aloud to say anything because she's a woman?

    Now, if it's in relation to degrading comments, or any kind of harassment, regardless of gender it's never OK to tell someone to "just deal with it" (if that's what you meant by your statement), but anyone should be able to be told to get their heads out of their asses if it's warranted.

    And that's part of the problem.

    We've gone from addressing a very serious issue of harassment at the workplace, to way overcompensating for it. Now it doesn't matter if it's actually happening or not, it's dependent on how that person feels. And that, to me, is the big problem. Because if someone is a fragile nutcase, if they "feel" uncomfortable, well that's it then, we have to adjust to them. What needs to happen is for overly-sensitive and fragile people to be told to toughen up if they want to be in a public/work environment.

    And a reporter does not get that same consideration, because their workplace is in public. When you go out of your way to put yourself out there in public, you have to accept that as part of the job you will be interacting with the public in non-work environments. So you're going to have to deal with people making faces behind you on camera, or mocking you, or shouting crap at you... that's part of the job. Does it suck? Yes. But welcome to "the public"... it's made up of all sorts of people, some very nice and respectful, some drunken frat bros, some crack ho's, some thugs (the Irish kind).
     
  8. sisterkathlouise

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    How do you not see the difference between someone being incapable of handling professional criticism and someone being sexually harassed on television?

    As a woman, usually I'm able to laugh off or ignore inappropriate comments, but sometimes you reach a breaking point, because being harassed every day is taxing. I don't want to hear creepy comments from random strangers about how they think I fuck, I don't want random strangers offering to walk me home, and I won't just give that random stranger a smile when they tell me to because I owe them nothing.

    Re: Trigger warnings, I think they have their place. I remember reading The Bluest Eye and I Know Why the Caged Bird Sings in school, and got trigger warnings from both of my teachers about the rapes that happen in those books. In situations like that I think trigger warnings are absolutely appropriate, but with trauma it's difficult because ANYTHING can be a trigger. Working in foster care, one of my kids was really triggered by red kool-aid, and I had another kid crawl under his bed and hide when I said "you're just all over the place, aren't you?" because apparently it was a phrase his mother used to say.
     
  9. Nettdata

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    What part of this statement did you not read? I'm guessing all of it:

     
  10. sisterkathlouise

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    I read that, and also this part:

    ]

    Where you essentially tell her to suck it up.
     
  11. Nettdata

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    If that shit that is being shouted at her is sexual harassment, then take the appropriate legal action to deal with it. I wasn't saying she should have to suck it up for that, but if it's just someone saying crap and being annoying, then yes, suck it up.

    I'm also curious to know if her first action was to tweet the video or to call the cops? Has she followed up with any kind of legal action?

    I'm also saying that you kind of have to understand that it IS going to happen... if you're at all familiar with the viral videos that are happening, and you approach drunk people for a comment as they're coming out of a sporting event, and put them in the spotlight, shit like this will happen. "10 times a day" apparently.

    There are a lot of assholes in public, so when your job is to interview people in public, don't be fucking surprised or play the victem if they act like assholes.

    If she were just an ordinary person (non reporter without a camera crew) coming out of the game and had that shouted at her, I'd have a different outlook on it.
     
  12. Clutch

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    I refuse to call this sexual harassment. The guy yelled in another man's face, and he only cared about the camera. He didn't even care that a woman was there. The point was to ruin the shot by yelling something vulgar, but because he said pussy instead of shit it's suddenly sexual harassment?
     
  13. Juice

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    But how would she have known that? From her perspective, she was clearly the subject of that statement. If I was his employer, I would probably assume it was too.

    On that point, Im willing to be he signed an acknowledgement of a lengthy code of conduct when he started his job. Violation of which gave his employer cause to fire him. Regardless of whether or not his actions outside of the office should be actionable, if the code of conduct includes provisions which cover his behavior, he shouldnt be shocked that he was let go.
     
  14. sisterkathlouise

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    The phrase "fuck her right in the pussy" is explicitly sexual. I don't care why he did it, I would absolutely feel harassed in that situation. I think it's also telling that the vast majority of the videos on youtube are of men doing that to female reporters.
     
  15. Nettdata

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    Totally agree.
     
  16. sisterkathlouise

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    In most states, there is very little legal protection from street harassment for women. Typically, they require that the harassment me repetitive and involve reasonable fear for one's safety. So your run-of-the-mill cat calls and lewd comments are legal. But just because it isn't illegal does not mean it isn't sexual harassment.
     
  17. Pinkcup

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    Nah. It's sexual harassment, plain and simple. It's odd that so many of you can't seem to grasp this point, although maybe this is where your understanding of how things are and how I want them to be has broken down and this is why you're massively butthurt over having to monitor your speech.

    Nett, it's terrible to hear about your coworker crying and ruining meetings and disrupting professional discourse and <insert other terrible Rant & Rave behavior I am vaguely recalling as I write this>, but that has fuck all to do with her vagina and everything to do with an inability to professionally handle criticism and communicate effectively with her department. Sucks for you, but a shitty coworker is a shitty coworker. And if your shitty coworker happened to be a man, the acceptable response to crying after meetings still would not include the phrase "toughen the fuck up." I understand this is how some men speak to each other, but that's absolutely not a professional avenue of criticism nor is it a useful means of effecting change. That's probably why H.R. Departments don't hand out "toughen the fuck up" memos, no? It alienates the listener and doesn't do squat except for allowing the speaker to feel good about expressing him/herself in a sharp, caustic manner.

    I'm sure everything would be just swell and dandy if y'all could hand out "toughen the fuck up" notices to stuck-up, PC-obsessed "bitches" who prevent everyone from being "edgy" and "blunt" but since we live in the Real World™ and not whatever fantasy world you'd like to exist....well....sorry, I guess? You'll still have to exercise tact and discretion and polite behavior or deal with the consequences if you don't. I am genuinely sorry it's such a struggle for you all to exercise good manners, I suppose. But hopefully you can sleep better at night knowing that you're making the world a better place, one stifled epithet at a time.

    EDIT: goddamn it, how have three people posted already
     
  18. Nettdata

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    And yet she's in Ontario.
     
  19. Crown Royal

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    Just call me Topher

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    Most jobs have such things clearly stated in your employee orientation. It isn't even "fine print". Most clearly state that intentionally embarrassing yourself or acting lewd publicly in places such as live TV or social media while being identified as company staff is grounds for termination.
     
  20. sisterkathlouise

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    Taken from the Criminal Code of Canada:

    Criminal Harassment
    264. (1) No person shall, without lawful authority and knowing that another person is harassed or recklessly as to whether the other person is harassed, engage in conduct referred to in subsection (2) that causes that other person reasonably, in all the circumstances, to fear for their safety or the safety of anyone known to them.

    Sounds pretty fucking similar.
     
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