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Fantasy Football, but better because BOOKS

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Pinkcup, Jan 22, 2013.

  1. FreeCorps

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    See, here I would argue this is much like saying a football player can't be a great sportsman because he only does one sport well. Although I'll admit my most of my authors are pigeonholed (WoT is Jordan's only significant work, outside of the Conan re-writes, and that's fantasy also).
     
  2. Nom Chompsky

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    We could maybe even have brackets based on genre? Like fantasy/sci-fi, modern, children's, etc.


    If we have a children's bracket, Roald Dahl, for sure. I don't see why youth books should be excluded, when for a lot of us they're more formative, and they're really tricky to really do very well.
     
  3. Juice

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    This. I don't think people quite grasp his impact. Yeah he's got a less than favorable reputation with lit snobs, but his books are great and parts of our pop culture completely evolved from his writing.
     
  4. T0m88

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    Hemingway: Because he's motherfucking Hemingway. So what if he couldn't write women characters worth a damn, reading a book by Hemingway literally involves stopping at least once every two or three pages and going "woooooah." because he just dropped some colossal insight-bomb at you, without even drawing attention to it. He just sorta tucked it away into the prose, like he didn't even fully realise it was there. Plus, he has one of the most influential (and widely copied) writing styles out there.

    Steven Pressfield: Gates of (Motherfucking) Fire. Need I say more? Aside from the fact that he's penned my absolute favourite novel ever, the guy's a bona fide artist at writing about men at war, and he's a pretty serious ancient Greek scholar, too.

    Michael Crichton: He wrote fucking Jurassic Park. He was incredibly adept at weaving tense plots and some of his books were well-nigh unputdownable - I remember the first time I ever stayed awake all night reading a book was when I was reading Disclosure, because I had to find out what happened in the end. Plus he was really good at making (sometimes questionable) science understandable and accessible to the masses. Timeline is, to date, the only reason I can vaguely comprehend discussions about Quantum Physics.

    I also second Cormac McCarthy and Stephen King.

    Dishonourable Mention: Bret Easton Ellis. I thought American Psycho was legitimately great, aside from those FUCKING interludes about 80's music that, if I had been Ellis's agent, I would've taken a goddamn crowbar to. It made me queasy at times how vile Patrick Bateman was in that book. I like some of his other work too, but lately, he's gone heavily downhill, having apparently completely bombed as a screenwriter (see "The Canyons" being rejected by every film festival ever) and has been acting like a completely obnoxious douche to all and sundry, getting into pointless spats over twitter with random people. Also, having written American Psycho, you've got some fucking balls to call Zero Dark Thirty "morally indefensible". At least nobody in that movie is describing in graphic, loving detail how your protagonist sewed a live rat into a woman's vagina and let it eat its way out of her stomach.
     
  5. T0m88

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    Roald Dahl's a Norwegian-descended Brit. He was born and grew up in England and flew for the RAF in World War II.
     
  6. Rush-O-Matic

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    I think Stephen King gets dismissed often because the volume of his work is so great, that he's got a few clunkers in there. And, he's clearly written some throw-aways just for the money. (Love the Dark Tower series, but this last tack-on, Wind Through the Keyhole, was barely related to the characters.) But, then, part of that commercial drive led to the Green Mile - did anybody besides me read that in the monthly serial way it was released?

    Also, I don't get why William S Burroughs made the top 32 on the Guardian list. I haven't read much from him, simply because I didn't enjoy it. It always felt like he was a "beat" poser or just being radical for the sake of the gimmick.
     
  7. FreeCorps

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    Every time I think of the tacked on ending to The Dark Tower, after King warns you not to read on (I should've listened), I get twitchy. Of course, I thought the second half of the last book went rapidly downhill. The Crimson King climax, something that had been building up the entire series, can suck my balls.

    I kinda sorta want to add Terry Brooks in fantasy, but I can't bring myself to do it. Christopher Stasheff is a lesser known fantasy author I definitely would though. His books have a great mix of action and humor.
     
  8. Nom Chompsky

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    Are we limiting ourselves to American novelists? I suppose we probably should...

    Stephanie Meyers it is then.
     
  9. T0m88

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    Dunno, the original post specified Norteamericanos. Otherwise there's Bernard Cornwell, George Macdonald Fraser, Terry Pratchett, J K Rowling, J R R Tolkien, C S Lewis, Joseph O' Connor, Philip Pullman... just to name the first bunch that popped into my head. I think it makes the sample a bit too large.
     
  10. FreeCorps

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    Actually, the first post complains that in its original iteration the contest includes only North Americans. I believe Ms. Pinkcup is in favor of broadening the field.

    If it does indeed make it too large maybe we can have two brackets? 'Mericuh (and friends) in one, the rest of the world in the other.
     
  11. Misanthropic

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    Since it appears to be too difficult to go back and read the first post, I've quoted it here for the rest of you. Opening this up to any author on planet Earth is something we've sort of done already ( in "name your favorite author" format), and would be impossible to have any kind of meaningful discussion unless all of us were infinitely multilingual.

    Now, assuming that we are indeed sticking to North America -

    Neal Stephenson - Author of Snow Crash, Cryptonomicon, the books of the Baroque Cycle, and REAMDE among others. Probably the leading techno author, his novels delve heavily into philosophy, science and tech. He tells a good story dense with imagery, and his inclusion of mathematics and science is done knowledgeably, not as a prop.

    Stephen R. Donaldson - Most know him as a fantasy author for his Thomas Covenant Books, and to a lesser degree as a science fiction author for his Gap series. Donaldson takes a unique approach in these genres in that, rather than quest for adventure taking center stage, they are vehicles to explore the psychology of the characters. His main themes explore the motivations of his protagonists rather than the superficial actions. These motivations are often deep seated , traumatic experiences. As a result, his protagonists are typically deeply flawed people, simply trying to get by in life, who wind up dealing with circumstances well over their heads.

    Mary Doria Russell - the four book rule notwithstanding, she would be included for The Sparrow alone. Arguably science fiction, others have aid it is "a philosophical novel about the nature of good and evil and what happens when a man tries to do the right thing, for the right reasons and ends up causing incalculable harm". I think more than that, it points out our human arrogance, and our inability to think beyond our own limited experience. The sequel (Children of God), wasn't nearly as good, but continues the "unintended consequences" theme in a way that draws parallels to colonialism. Lest you think she only writes science fiction, World War II Italy (A Thread of Grace) and the old West (Doc) are both within her realm, and she handles both well.
     
  12. Now Slappy

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    There are a bunch of authors already mentioned who I would second, Steven King and Michael Crichton just to name two.

    There is one author though who hasn't been mentioned who I would like to nominate, and that is John Green. He is relatively young and so far has only published four books(and co-authored a couple of others). They are Looking for Alaska, An Abundance of Katherines, Paper Towns, and The Fault In Our Stars. His book are written for the young adult genre, but as a 41 year old guy I have enjoyed them all. Definitely worth checking out if you haven't already. Not to mention, but three of his four books are currently gracing the NYT Best Sellers list with The Fault In Our Stars having been on the list since it was released more than a year ago.
     
  13. lust4life

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    Several already mentioned that I agree with such as Twain,Steinbeck, King, Irving, and would also add Theodore Geisel (do you know of any kid who didn't have at least 1 Dr. Seuss book?), Thomas Wolfe, Ken Kesey, Phillip Roth and Truman Capote.
     
  14. Pinkcup

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    Oh, man. John Green. I have such mixed feelings about him. I thought Looking for Alaska was painfully juvenile, even by YA novel standards. In fact, I was kind of irritated that I spent money on it. But An Abundance of Katherines was extremely entertaining and it convinced me to buy The Fault In Our Stars, which I haven't read yet. I don't know. I try to read three things by an author before I make a definitive decision on whether I find them worthy enough to continue reading, so the jury is still out. But Looking For Alaska really hurt his chances with me.

    For what it's worth, I like the genre brackets. There is no reason the winner of the North American Sci-Fi bracket shouldn't get the opportunity to run up against the winner of the North American Poet/Children/YA/Modern/whatever bracket.

    We need to keep a running list, though, and have the list separated into genres. I am loving all the submissions (whoever submitted John Irving will be getting a green dot from me momentarily) but the fun part is actually the competition.
     
  15. CharlesJohnson

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    From Blood Meridian, the powder making scene:

    I did not like No Country as a book. Some of his other works are tedious, underplotted, in need of an editor (Suttree was particularly frustrating). But his voice is unique and more powerful than a 1000 Rocco Siffredi penises. The Road is probably my third favorite book. It is the culmination of a lifetime's work, a mastery of the craft that will never be duplicated nor challenged. It is a perfect book.

    Let me also chalk up another for Mr. King. More than any other he is my hero. You could do worse than an O. Henry Award winner. He gets shafted by the literati because they don't see horror as a viable genre, when, if done effectively and well, like King and like Joe Hill and Ray Bradbury, it adds a powerful dramatic element to a human story. The Long Walk, Full Dark, No Stars, The Green Mile, all legitimate literature.

    The ending from The Green Mile (SPOILER ALERT):

     
  16. Bundy Bear

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    R. A. Salvatore, I've just finished reading all of his Forgotten Realms novels involving Drizzt Do'Urden and have found them to be very descriptive and highly entertaining.
     
  17. Kampf Trinker

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    Most of the authors I would choose have already been mentioned, but I'll add.

    Jonathon Franzen: The Corrections is arguably the best American satire ever written. The book is hilarious, entertaining the whole way through, and has a realism few novels do.

    Jeffrey Eugenides: Some of his writing comes across as disturbing just for the sake of disturbing, like The Virgin Suicides. While Middlesex can also be grotesque, it has an eerie way of making the perverse appear perfectly normal. Probably my favorite feel good/self discovery novel of the 2000s.
     
  18. Nom Chompsky

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    Not a novel, but Stephen King's On Writing deserves a mention. It's one of the better primers out there.
     
  19. toejam

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    The link in the original post nailed my picks. Hemingway (duh), McCarthy, and Philip Roth. Portnoy's Complaint is fucking brilliant. I don't think I've ever read anything that captures Jewish neuroticism as well. Ballsack would love it.

    Crown, I have to ask why the hell you like Gravity's Rainbow. So, why? I loved the two other Pynchon books I read (The Crying of Lot 49, and Inherent Vice, but GR was a painful, unrewarding slog through I still don't know what.
     
  20. Crown Royal

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    I know people that hate it, I honestly can't blame you for saying that. It is not for all tastes, but it just seemed like it was everything to me. It just astonished me how it seemed like it was written by at least ten different authors. Love and sex and war and death and rockets and off-brand behaviour and black boxes and hundreds of characters pinballing between each other's lives. It's easy to see why people think it's nonsense, it's about at easy to follow as Ulysses, uber-comlex and digressive as fuck. V is another great book by him. No, it's not about lizard aliens that eventually get killed by hot air balloons led by the Beastmaster.