As someone who has no religious background, the whole concept of marriage makes no sense to me. I also see no point on giving the government control over my relationships by entering into a marriage contract. How does such a contract substantiate a relationship any more than an assumed commitment between myself and a prospective girlfriend? From my point of view, such a contract can only hurt me unless I marry someone considerably wealthier than I, but I suspect that this will not be the case in the next 5 years.
The legal institution of marriage is a powerful one, and not just because "The [bitch/asshole] gets half my stuff when we split!" Same sex couples have been fighting for the right to marry for a long time, and not just because they'd like a frivolous ceremony and nice rings. Marriage carries with it a host of benefits for both partners; different tax laws apply (in most cases you can split your income, thereby paying less tax on it), property/children rights and even having a say in the life of your spouse. Imagine you are going to work tomorrow and you get hit by a car. You are pronounced brain dead, however, you are still technically 'alive' on life support. Who gets the say in whether or not to pull the plug? Who gets to decide to donate your organs or not? Who presides over your estate? If you don't have a spouse (or a will) it typically defaults to your mother, if she's still alive. Do you want her acting on your behalf? What if you've been 'with' your girlfriend for 15 years? Doesn't she have a better idea of what you'd like than anyone else? I bring up this example to show that marriage has many benefits and responsibilities that extend beyond just a religious or commitment ceremony. It is not for everyone, but it is a powerful institution that allows you to essentially choose your family and who will be considered 'your other half,' particularly in the eyes of the law.
Marriage isn't just about religion. It didn't even begin because of religion, it's just that most people have their own cultural/spiritual views on what that means. It's probably the oldest cultural practice, and one of the very, very few universal ones (except for that semen sucking African tribe that meets with women just to mate). Are you really confused as to why someone would choose a lifelong partner? Or do you think they just do it because of the bible?
The biggest reason not to get married? You actually have to include sombody else in the decisions that affect all aspects of your life. There are consequences to bad decisions that will actually have an effect on someone else other than yourself. I have never understood the "marriage is a just a piece of paper" argument. It's is obviously much more than that presently and has been throughout history. Maybe this type of thought process is why divorce is so prominent. If you see marriage as nothing more than a piece of paper, to be broken whenever the thought strikes you, than that's all it will be. If you see it as a long term commitment to your significant other, as putting your life and your trust in another person indivdual, as growing together with someone through all the ins and outs of a normal life, than maybe it would be more succesful. I have been married going on 3 years and I can categorically say that I have not lost one stitch of my freedon or indepence. This is because my wife and I didn't treat marriage as a piece of paper and I actually tried to marry a woman that actually respects me as a person and our relationship together. My wife balances me out and offsets me and would never think of demanding anything from me. In-turn, I respect her and her freedoms the same way she does mine. We travel together, play together, discuss topics of all varieties, sit together in silence, whatever and it is great. Could I do the same thing with a girlfriend or even a close friend? Sure, but if my wife is as great as I have lead you to belive, then why wouldn't I marry her? What did I really have to lose? Man, do I sound gay or what? Maybe it's the percocets and kidney stones talking, but I am feeling a little emotional today.
Exactly. And yet you can have all that without being married in the eyes of the law, unless you want to save on taxes that bad. Yes
Reasons not to get married: You* are a fucking douchebag, and your future spouse is probably one too. If you haven't realised it yet, you shouldn't get married. *yes, you.
Ok, it's not my business to tell you to get married, but if you're going to babble on like you're enlightened, and talk about marriage like it's some deranged social construction you need to get your head checked. Here's a glaring clue as to why you don't get it. If you're too selfish to be monogamous, or 'put up with someone' for that long, then don't fucking do it. I know it's beyond your comprehension that people willingly and happily make sacrifices for their significant others, but sometimes when you feel that stupid love bullshit your life becomes as much about your significant other as it does you. Willingly! Who'd of thunk it? Really though, you make it sound like a healthy relationship is nothing other than codependent dysfunction. As if every damn thing you do needs their stamp of approval. Plenty of women will give you freedom, it's just that if they have any respect for themselves they'll expect commitment. I don't give a fuck what age you are. Your nonsense applies to exactly zero age groups. The basic reasoning behind why people choose to get married is something I understood before I started high school. Seriously, what's next? I can't ever have children, they'll tie me down too much. To be fair, I've never been married, but I don't think it's fair to use logic saying if I haven't failed at it I can't have an opinion on the subject. I probably am about the same age as you (22). I have had a very serious relationship that failed, for many reasons, but that didn't leave me walking away questioning the entire concept. We talked about marriage a few times (in an undetermined time frame sort of way). I didn't get married because I know I'm too young, and it wasn't going to work... with that person.
I take everything back, you are much too smart for me. Your intelligent and well thought out arguments are baffling my senses, I have no response. I am going to file for divorce today and spend the remainder of my life worrying about myself and no one else. Sacrifice, Shmacrifice, it's for morons. I don't know what I was thinking in the first place, getting married and all. I must have REALLY wanted those tax breaks*. *And just to further your hatred of marriage I'll let you in on a secret: The tax breaks aren't really worth it.
MArriage is like the States' Health Care Reform issue. Every single person has a different opinion, and that opinion is that everybody in the world is stupid except for them. It's a fruit not everyone should pick. I have at least a couple of very close friends that I can honestly say are NOT CUT OUT FOR IT, and never will be. They will probably never get married, and they will no doubt be happier that way. Me, I'm cut out for it. I've been married for three years without "taking a break", any physical altercations or other ugly business. Sure, a closet door might get punched once a year or so but everybody has blow-outs whether it be your spouse, your parents, your friends or family. Blow-outs let of steam, and there's almost NEVER any harm done (except the occasional murder-suicide, but who's counting?). Like I said before, in my own opinion the most important aspect of marriage is tolerance. If your better half comes home from a night out and you feel the need to slaughter their buzz them with distict attourney-style questions instead of just asking "Did you have a good time?" you are not cut out for marriage. If you politely throw an empty at some guy's/girl's face for "making eyes" at YOUR guy/girl, you are not cut out for marriage. And if you are fucking somebody else outside your relationship, well, you just answered your own question. Jealousy, infidelity, bad temperment: relationship nails in the coffin. Of course, you also need SPACE. Once you get married, remember: your friends still exist, and they still consider you a friend. If you ditch them because you think you should spend ALL time with your spouse 24/7, you'll soon become "that friend", and if you heard what your friends are saying behind your back about you, you would NEVER stop crying. Also remember: your spouse's friends ALSO exist, and if you DARE ever say the fucking line "It's them or me" I hope they all piss into your coffin right before burying you in the salt flats. Asshole.
For the first two years, the nose is the last orifice you need to be concerned with. My marriage is awesome. I couldn't imagine life without my soulmate. Her family on the other hand... Let's just say I appreciate the distance between Texas and NJ.
I will have been with my girl for 10 years this December, we are not married, nor do we have children. We do own a house together though. Why aren’t we married? Why would we be? At the end of the day we don’t need our relationship legitimised by friends, family or traditional society, if they don’t like it they can get fucked. Chirpy is spot on regarding maintaining a relationship, keep it fresh, go out on dates, don’t turn into a tub of shit, explore different interests, holiday separately half the time etc. Couples who live in each other’s pockets overmuch struggle to go the distance in my experience, things get stale in most cases. In saying that if we decided to drop a spawn we would get married.
If you think that monogamous marriage is any kind of cultural norm in an 'older then religion, as inevitable as wanting to be sheltered while you poop so that a Lion doesn't eat you' sort of context - you fail at Anthropology. Life long monogamy between two people has its roots in the same cultural sources as not eating pork and ritual bathing. It's a hygiene ritual that was promoted to superstitious idiots under the guise that it was gods will - and before penicillin, refrigeration and anti-bacterial hand spray, it saved a lot of lives in cultures that went on to become successful. But in terms of populace adherence? Geographic spread as an evolutionary trend rather than an introduced and coerced behavior? Percentage of history where it was practiced by the dominant cultural groups? Monogamy is a flash in the pan. It's not any kind of survival inevitability like wanting to close the door when you take a crap so a lion can't get in. It's just a way to reduce the spread of syphilis. The same way not eating pork reduces the spread of digestive parasite infections. With modern sex education, condoms and penicillin? It's just not that necessary to the continuation of humanity. Either as a species or as a functional social group. That said? My marriage is fucking great. I'm 28 and I've been married for 5 and a half years. I love my wife and we have a great relationship with each other. The fact that we're married is largely irrelevant to the fact that we adore each other and work well together. The few times being married has impacted my life in a way that being in a relationship wouldn't have were largely positive. The few times when I've been a jackass and if I was just dating I might have broken things off and run away - I spent the extra 5 minutes to work through shit. Marriage isn't for everyone and it certainly won't save your shitty relationship from being shitty. But it won't stop your awesome relationship from being awesome either. Unless either you or the person you're in a relationship with is an idiot.
While I disagree with oldrooter that there in an evolutionary advantage and therefore imperative for the Father to stick around and having a hardwired “love” connection to the mother of his children. I agree with his last line and would like to take it a bit further. I know people who have gotten engaged because that ran out of things to talk about as a couple, married when they ran out of things to talk about as fiancés and had a kid when that was getting stale... You can see where that’s going to end up.
Pro: You've always got a 'plus one' for any shitty event you have to go to. Con: You're always a 'plus one' for any shitty event your spouse has to go to. Pro: You have lots of sex. Con: It's with yourself while watching porn. Pro: You've always got someone to eat meals with. Con: You have to pretend you care about what they're saying. Pro: Valentines Day! Con: Valentines Day. Pro: You always have someone to listen to you. Con: They will use it against you. Probably in a court of law. Pro: You have someone to share your dreams with. Con: They will crush those dreams once they know what they are. Pro: You're rarely alone. Con: You're NEVER alone. Pro: You learn that sex isn't that important. Con: You learn that sex is really important. Usually in a court of law. Pro: Chicks dig guys who can commit. Con: Sleeping with those chicks. This ALWAYS comes up in a court of law.
Thank you so much for the lesson. It's odd that if you're going to quote one of my two posts you picked the one that has nothing to do with monogamy. If you want to really debate whether religion or the concept of monogamy is older it sounds like a waste of time to me, although that has little to do with my posts. My point was that people often choose to get married for reasons outside of religion, maybe like you did? While I have nothing against people who choose to have open relationships, there are plenty of people more comfortable in monogamous relationships. I have no idea how you read my post and came to this: . Uh... yeah I agree? You can call it possessive if you want, but the majority of people aren't comfortable with someone else fucking their wife. If you are that's great, your choice. I never meant to imply there's anything wrong with that. I was saying people use religion to interpret and define marriage, although it is unnecessary. And yes, it is practiced in 99%+ of cultures. Yes, it is one of the oldest cultural practices. Arguably not the oldest, but let's not get into a chicken vs the egg debate.
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Christ there are some touchy mother fuckers. I* swear, some people in this thread seem to be so against marriage that I wonder if they refuse to associate with "those damned monogamouses." (I like to make up words, its fun). I think it has been said, but it can be reiterated. Marriage works for some, but not for others. I know guys who will never get married. They love being single, coming home to their own place, having their own stuff, the thrill of hunting for new women, and all that good stuff. Are there advantages to that lifestyle? Of course there are, to deny that would be stupid. At the same time, there are those that get married and enjoy it, such as myself. I've been married three years now, and I've been with my wife since we were both in high school. Yes, we are 'those people.' The couple that met in high school and stayed together. We've been together for ten years, now, and we continue to get along great. We rarely argue, and when I'm feeling like shit she can always make me feel better, and I can always make her feel better. Ultimately, it is virtually impossible to explain to someone who is madly in love with their freedom that marriage can work and be great, because they don't care. At the same time, it is tough to explain to someone that is married and really loves that one person that being single is better. Its like republicans and democrats... and just like politics, people can get just as heated defending their sides, and become completely closed off to the points the other side may have, if only out of a misguided anger towards people who don't necessarily think their way or agree with them. Its actually kinda sad, when you really think about it. Just figure out what it is YOU want. Do YOU want to have someone there when you come home at night? Do you want there to be someone there to cheer you up when you feel like shit? Want someone to go to dinner with and chat with? Get married. Want to come home to your own place? Make your own schedule? Love the 'thrill of the hunt' (as my single friends put it)? Then stay single. Just don't shit all over someone who doesn't agree with you, because it is all personal opinion. *this post comes from someone who has been shit on constantly by his single friends for getting married young. Glad you enjoy your life, but does that mean that because my life is different that it is impossible to enjoy mine?
Hey look morons, there's actually a person on here that doesn't resort to baseless judgments and childish name calling when someone doesn't agree with them! Wow! The Idiot Board is not actually full of idiots. I hope you married bastards choke on your wedding rings (except Nettdata he's cool, I dunno if you're married though) and that includes you D26 even if I did just praise you. I jerk off to naked pictures of your wife since you were wondering. Thanks for coming out, God bless you, good night.