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Elephants and Jackasses...

Discussion in 'Permanent Threads' started by Nettdata, Oct 14, 2016.

  1. Nettdata

    Nettdata
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    Mr. Toast

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    In Comp Sci, we call it "The Strangler Pattern", which is probably not a good thing to relate to Health Care...

    https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/azure/architecture/patterns/strangler
     
  2. dixiebandit69

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    I've got a question for Juice, 'Nerds, and everyone else with badass insurance who is saying "Fuck M4A! I already have kick-ass healthcare!"

    How are you going to feel about it when your kids enter the workforce, and they can't afford awesome coverage, and their job doesn't offer it?

    And I don't want to hear some bullshit answer like "Well of course, MY children will be managing Fortune 500 companies straight out of college."

    You don't know how your kids are going to turn out yet, and we sure as shit don't know what the economy will be like then.
     
  3. Crown Royal

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    Just call me Topher

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    Everyone knows they’re capable of squeezing out a smaller version of themselves that AREN’T chips off the old block, just ask Michael Douglas or Demi Moore.
     
  4. Juice

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    Im not sure where to begin answering a retarded question like that.

    But I can sure as hell guess what the economy will be like under M4A since 40% of Americans are now obese and 85% of healthcare costs are for things like diabetes and heart disease. And considering political front runners are promoting free healthcare for illegals, you can count me the hell out. I just don’t give a shit about my fellow citizen (or illegal) enough to jack my taxes up to 70%.

    [​IMG]

    If there was more definitive proof that God doesn’t exist, I haven’t seen it.
     
  5. dixiebandit69

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    Well, you could start by answering whether you are going to hold the same opinion when your little girl is all grown up, and the only insurance she can afford is basically worthless.
     
  6. Juice

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    “You must accept [hypothetical condition] as fact before answering question.”

    I have no idea what the insurance/medical/job market landscape will look like in 20+ years when she’s looking for a job. And I’m not sure why you’re assuming the insurance market would be worthless. But sure, she will have to figure it out like everyone else does.
     
  7. Nettdata

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    I find it kind of strange that your base medical coverage is tied so closely to your jobs.

    We opened an office in the US recently and were kind of surprised that people wouldn't even talk to us unless we had the medical shit all sorted out before hand. They would not quit their current job until AFTER they'd signed up with new medical coverage.

    In retrospect, I get it, but man, it was not how we normally think up here.
     
  8. Crown Royal

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    I’ll be one of the last people to complain about what we have here. My biggest of very few negatives towards it personally would be hypochondriacs who abuse the ER/Urgent care. I was astonished from the statistics on how some people will go to the ER dozens of times in a month and clog up triage because they suffer from an all-in-your-head cold. You could go to University hospital ER and not see a doctor from dusk till dawn. I went in with a gaping fish mouth gash on my forearm 11pm at night and they told me “seven hours”. So I drive less than two hours north to a beach town and get seen instantly. Seven stitches fine in minutes, no waiting, no greasy goony-bird who smells like rotten A&W next to me who needs to see a doctor because they keep feeling tired late at night and wonder if they may need an emergency MRI.
     
  9. Nettdata

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    Yeah, don't get me wrong... we have plenty of issues with our medical system. I'd just rather have our problems to deal with when all is said and done.
     
  10. xrayvision

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    If our only problem was a clogged ER full of hobos and hypochondriacs, things would be much different here. We have the clogged ER AND a fucked up insurance system. We also have a law called EMTALA that lets anyone go to the ER and at a minimum get stabilized before being transported out. Back in the 80's hospitals were turning people away based on whether they were insured or not letting folks die. Merica.
     
  11. Kampf Trinker

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    I have a question for you people against public healthcare.

    Does the fact that we pay way more for lower quality care compared to the rest of the first world matter at all to you? Do you discount that completely? Do you think our care is actually just as good or better?
     
  12. Aetius

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    It's one of the things I hate most about our healthcare. I changed jobs and now I don't have dental. Can I get dental through the public ACA exchanges? Apparently not, because to get dental through the exchange you also have to get your medical through the exchange. I'm still trying to figure this stupid shit out.

    Getting sick -> being unable to work -> losing your insurance is a common Catch-22 in the States, and on a more economic level tying healthcare to employment has a marked depressing effect on entrepreneurship because people who would otherwise be willing to take a run at starting a business can't afford to forfeit employer sponsored healthcare that their family relies on.
     
  13. Kampf Trinker

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    Just in case there was any doubt left: https://www.nytimes.com/2020/02/27/us/politics/democratic-superdelegates.html

    Just to be clear, his "limited support" has him beating Trump in every poll, often by large margins, and has positioned him to be the overwhelming favorite to win the democrat primaries. Yes, you can argue hypotheticals all day, but their claimed justification is literally the polar opposite of reality. Remember the last time running a centrist was the clear answer? Let's see- they lost the house, they lost the presidency, they lost the senate, they lost the state senates, they lost the governor positions... actually there's not a single thing they did well at. The results were so bad it was arguably the worst catastrophe in the entire history of the party. If it had been any worse the republicans would have been able to write constitutional amendments at will.

    So what's their answer? Fuck the data. Fuck the polls. Fuck where the party enthusiasm is at. Fuck the voters. Fuck the votes. We're just going to do our own thing, and eat shit if you don't like our explanation.

    For sure. That's definitely how you beat Trump. Could there even be a more reliable method than forcing out the guy voters picked, and forcing in another useless shill nobody wanted? That's exactly what you do to turn your base out. Give them a reason, make them care. Great stuff guys. You really thought this through.

    This is such a fucking joke. They don't care if it would destroy the party. They don't give a shit if it means Trump's chances of winning reelection go through the roof. They don't care what policies are better or worse for the American people. They're happy to let you know what's really important to them; protecting their donors and their doing anything in their power to prevent anyone from rocking the boat.

    I don't even what to say to people who are so fucking into it with thinking that backing these shit stains to the bitter end is some kind of noble crusade, and you can pat yourself on the back at the end of the day knowing you're fighting for the good guys. I shudder to think what they would have to do or say for some Americans to accept what they actually stand for, and what they actually use their office for.

    Because this is the kind of shit they're saying right now:

    What clearer way to do that than directly undermine the voters? That is the argument, in complete seriousness, that he is trying to make to justify himself.
     
  14. Nettdata

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    The fact that career politicians on both sides are afraid of Bernie screams to me that he’s the best choice to try and unfuck your politics.
     
  15. GTE

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    Most things I read say they only way Bernie wins is if the young voters turn out in record numbers in the likes we've never seen before. Hell, even Bernie said in his 60 Minutes interview this week that that's the only way he wins. But then again, with all the free shit he's giving away. why wouldn't the young vote turn out for him? He's the eighth grader running for student body promising pizza five days a week, no homework and an extra month of summer vacation.
    https://www.cbsnews.com/news/bernie...tial-front-runner-anderson-cooper-60-minutes/ (skip forward to 9 mins and then 12:15 for the freebies)
     
  16. Kampf Trinker

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    And the people who write the things you read have no basis to make those projections other than that they feel that way. This is one of the points I was trying to make. All of the data, from the polls to the votes now being cast suggest the complete opposite. They're free to make whatever guesses they want, but they should know they're putting their guesswork ahead of all established mathematical reasoning and statistics.

    We could have a discussion about the absurdity of many of Bernie's 'make it all free' reform plans and probably end up agreeing on quite a bit, but I'm just saying anyone projecting Bernie's chances of winning the presidency as low, or significantly worse than other democrat contenders, and then purporting that they arrived at this conclusion by mathematical and objective means is either extremely inept, or totally full of shit. After all, these are the same people who so confidently put Trump's chances at less than 10%.

    By the way, Bernie is doing extremely well with democrats who identify as moderate, or conservative. The exact groups "He'll never win with." As per usual with pundits, real world results take a backseat to bullshit and guesswork.

    Kicking out the candidate with the most votes and replacing them with someone who didn't even run in order to help your party's chances in the general election(which is what was repeatedly suggested by the superdelegates in the article I was commenting on) is so stupid on its face I don't even know where to begin. Then again, despite professing their profound concerns about what's best for America, they're not exactly suggesting this in the interest of the greater good.
     
  17. Kubla Kahn

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    The amount of bureaucracy he intends dwarfs what we already have a quite a bit. If you think growing the US government to epic proportions is going to unfuck anything I want some of what youre smoking. The only thing that is a bright light in his plan is the promises he makes on the campaign trail, like everyone's promises, don't go anywhere once theyre in office since we do have a system of checks and balances. Even he's had to walk some of them back in the face of the reality he won't have congressional support for most of it. Even still it's scary to think how much more power he wants to give the government and the amount he will be able to add. The departments and entitlements which will become, like all others, grotesque ever growing leviathans all subject to the same cyclical political bickering boondoggle as the rest. His only real allure, like Trump before him, is that he's an outsider with radically different ideas than the status quo ones everyone is sick of. His solutions aren't novel or even workable they just aren't the same bullshit.
     
  18. dixiebandit69

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    As others have mentioned, I don't agree with everything Bernie is saying, but I think he's the best- hell, only - shot we have at this point of improving the country this presidential season.

    If Trump stays in for another term, it's only going to get worse, and it will probably take at least a generation to un-fuck the country.

    If Biden wins, it's just going to be the status quo for 4-8 years.

    I also think that Bernie is the only one who could possibly beat Trump; I have a bad feeling that he won't, but the others don't stand a chance.
     
  19. Revengeofthenerds

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  20. Aetius

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    I know Trump supporters get mad when you call them dumb, but how much are the rest of us supposed to pretend exactly?